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 Topic: The Objectification Of Men In Media

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  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     OP - March 02, 2013, 09:29 AM
    When the subject of porn and female beauty comes up a lot is written by feminists and their supporters about the objectification of women in media and society based on physical appearance. And how this encourages a dependance on external validation, body image issues, etc. However very little is said about the objectification of men.

    IMO and IME the objectification of men is based on social status, utility and persona;

    Athletes (physicality), wealthy men (utility and social status), men in positions of power (social status), men in uniform (social status), bad boys (persona, social status), actors and entertainers (social status), bad boys with a heart of gold in fiction ie. fifty shades of grey, and twilight - from what I've heard (persona), etc.

    And IMO this objectification if internalized by men can lead to self hatred just as powerful as the objectification of women. When a man perceives himself to be of low social status (not in a position of power, not a bad boy, etc), and utility (no job, low income, etc) it can lead to serious self esteem issues.

    (Perhaps that's partly the reason why many nice guys are bitter about the female love of 'bad boys/jerks' and wealth. People shit on guys who are bitter, but applaud women who criticize cultural standards of beauty with the same passion. It seems to be OK for women to express disdain for standards that make them feel less than worthy, but if men do the same they are considered 'whiners who need to man up'.)

    It might be interesting for people to know that the suicide rate globally is disproportionately higher for males;

    Gender and suicide - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_and_suicide

    UK - http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jan/23/suicide-rates-men-gender-issue

    I'm not saying that objectification is the sole reason for disproportionate male suicide. But my questions is if feminists and non-feminists agree that the objectification of females in media leads to serious self-esteem issues in women, then why isn't the same considered for male objectification?

    If feminists and non-feminists agree that the standards of beauty that the media portrays is unattainable and therefore damaging. Then why isn't the same true for men in regards to the standard of acceptable status, persona, and utility that are presented in media?

    Here are some videos that talk about the objectification of men in media;

    (Others have pointed out that the statistics in this first vid are dubious)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3exzMPT4nGI

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-N9daqANcw

    Our culture seems to applaud hyper-masculinity, or denounces the concept of masculinity itself as 'archaic' or 'misogynistic'. Like someone else on another forum pointed out men can feel pulled between hyper-assertiveness, hyper-ambitiousness, stoicism, etc and the need to be hyper-sensitive, and pander to women (this applies to hetero and non-hetero men, you can pander to women non-sexually). It rarely shows simple masculinity where men enjoy expressing aggression, physicality, competitiveness, intentionality, but at the same time can express vulnerability, and sensitivity (ie. expressing that they have low self esteem, are stressed, depressed, or hurt.)

    What do you guys think about male objectification in media?

    Why does it seem to be OK for women to express dissatisfaction for media and cultural standards that make them feel less than worthy, but it's not OK for men?
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #1 - March 02, 2013, 10:15 AM
    Quote
    What do you guys think about male objectification in media?

    I don't think about it.  Smiley
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #2 - March 02, 2013, 10:20 AM
    That's an interesting topic you brought up there and I myself tend to have problem with the double standards shown by some feminists regarding on that issue e.g. Women shaming men by calling them sleazebag because they admire a pictures of naked women with boobs and big bootys but they have no problem ogling at men with six packs and pecs. Now that shit is mind boggling.

    For me the aspect of sexuality is where I draw the line and also disagree with radical feminist views on sexuality,prostitution and porn.
    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #3 - March 02, 2013, 10:46 AM
    I think it's because of the disproportionate amount of objectification of women particularly with regards to her body which is something people have very little control over -given what they have via genetics. The things men are portrayed as in the media are things to achieve in life, to work up through the social statuses (if you enjoy that bs), to have ambition in your career.... These are in your control to change, maybe not easily, but if you really wanted to you can work your way through that. In fact there's actually a positive aspect to this male objectification where men are driven to be more ambitious.
    "Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

    'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #4 - March 02, 2013, 10:57 AM
    I don't think you can really separate the two cases of objectification of women vs men, when you objectify women in certain ways, you basically also direct men to behave in certain ways as well as women.
    "Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

    'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #5 - March 02, 2013, 11:25 AM
    Quote from: Stardust on March 02, 2013, 10:46 AM
    I think it's because of the disproportionate amount of objectification of women particularly with regards to her body


    I disagree that it's disproportionate I just think (in hetero dating) it reflects how men and women tend to objectify. Men do it visually, and women do it based on persona, utility and status.

    The objectification of men is just as prevalent as female objectification IMO, it's just in different forms.

    Quote
    The things men are portrayed as in the media are things to achieve in life, to work up through the social statuses (if you enjoy that bs), to have ambition in your career.... These are in your control to change, maybe not easily, but if you really wanted to you can work your way through that.


    The majority can't be famous or in a position of power (management and politics) by definition.

    Also the state of the economy over the past few years prevents people from achieving career and economic success ie. the american dream.

    Quote
    In fact there's actually a positive aspect to this male objectification where men are driven to be more ambitious.


    And a major downside is the psychological problems that come when ambition doesn't bare fruit.

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/shenegotiates/2013/02/24/male-success-norms-are-bad-for-the-guys-too/

    Which perhaps contributes to the disproportionate suicide rate of men.
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #6 - March 02, 2013, 11:26 AM
    Quote from: Stardust on March 02, 2013, 10:57 AM
    when you objectify women in certain ways, you basically also direct men to behave in certain ways as well as women.


    Same in regards to male objectification.
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #7 - March 02, 2013, 11:53 AM
    I think this expected ambition thing is much more covert, compared to female objectification which is why it's not talked about as much. SD rightly pointed out that statistically very few will make it and be "successful". I don't think there's a positive aspect to this type objectification. The sad thing about objectification isn't about not being able to live up to expectations. It's about feeling the need to try, because you've internalized some BS unattainable status/persona as something that you should do or be and are pressured by it.
    Join us on chat. Click here.
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #8 - March 02, 2013, 12:02 PM
    Quote from: Stardust on March 02, 2013, 10:46 AM
    The things men are portrayed as in the media are things to achieve in life, to work up through the social statuses (if you enjoy that bs), to have ambition in your career.... These are in your control to change, maybe not easily, but if you really wanted to you can work your way through that.


    With the way the nature of political and economic situation is going on, its not everyone that is in control to change that unless one belongs to the class of elites or upper class family. Having an ambition in career, sure but only if the choice of career would land you into having a lucrative job that will give you enough resources to elevate your social status.

    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #9 - March 02, 2013, 12:03 PM
    Quote from: zooby on March 02, 2013, 11:53 AM
    I think this expected ambition thing is much more covert, compared to female objectification which is why it's not talked about as much. SD rightly pointed out that statistically very few will make it and be "successful". I don't think there's a positive aspect to this type objectification. The sad thing about objectification isn't about not being able to live up to expectations. It's about feeling the need to try, because you've internalized some BS unattainable status/persona as something that you should do or be and are pressured by it.


    Pretty much this too.
    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #10 - March 02, 2013, 12:48 PM
    Quote from: Stardust on March 02, 2013, 10:46 AM
    I think it's because of the disproportionate amount of objectification of women particularly with regards to her body which is something people have very little control over -given what they have via genetics. The things men are portrayed as in the media are things to achieve in life, to work up through the social statuses (if you enjoy that bs), to have ambition in your career.... These are in your control to change, maybe not easily, but if you really wanted to you can work your way through that. In fact there's actually a positive aspect to this male objectification where men are driven to be more ambitious.

    Pretty much this. I know I'll get shit for this but… it is said that a woman's appeal is in her youth and beauty -- two things she has no control over. Make-up and cosmetic surgery can only do so much. Social status and employment are attainable; unless you've inherited a great deal of wealth, you'd probably have to have worked hard to attain wealth and built a good career for yourself. Being born beautiful isn't an achievement, and people shouldn't feel worthless or ashamed because of the way they look. 
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #11 - March 02, 2013, 01:05 PM
    Women can exercise and diet, they have control over that.

    The idea that 'anyone can make it' is western capitalist propaganda (and I'm not a rabid leftist), hard work isn't the only thing that is needed for success. You also need opportunity. That's nonsense thinking that leads people to believe that everyone living in poverty needs to simply 'work harder'.

    Many people lost their homes and business in the meltdown of  '08, it had nothing to do with a lack of hard work, it was simply economic factors beyond any individual's control.

    The breakdown of the middle class in the US

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dK_RnxYdrqU

    The majority can't be famous or in positions of power (social status) by definition.
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #12 - March 02, 2013, 01:06 PM
    Quote from: Al-Alethia on March 02, 2013, 12:48 PM
    Pretty much this. I know I'll get shit for this but… it is said that a woman's appeal is in her youth and beauty -- two things she has no control over. Make-up and cosmetic surgery can only do so much. Social status and employment are attainable; unless you've inherited a great deal of wealth, you'd probably have to have worked hard to attain wealth and built a good career for yourself. Being born beautiful isn't an achievement, and people shouldn't feel worthless or ashamed because of the way they look. 

    Should a man who doesn't attain high social status and employment feel worthless then? That is bullshit, it's not all in his control and the fact that you two suggest it is would only add to the disappointment a man would feel when he inevitably fails.

    There are greater qualities of value that a person can possess rather than their job or looks. It's not to do with the nature of the objectification. It's the objectification itself. It's inherently wrong whether it's happening to women or men.
    Join us on chat. Click here.
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #13 - March 02, 2013, 01:11 PM
    Quote
    That is bullshit, it's not all in his control and the fact that you two suggest it is would only add to the disappointment a man would feel when he inevitably fails.


    Exactly.
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #14 - March 02, 2013, 01:25 PM
    So if we recognize that objectification is morally wrong, why continue to judge our own self worth by the scales of those who objectify? If there are impossible standards that are themselves based on criteria that we find unimportant, who is forcing us to be at all bothered by them? Why care?
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #15 - March 02, 2013, 01:30 PM
    You're right we shouldn't care. But sometimes people don't know any better when they're being bombarded with it in the media.
    Join us on chat. Click here.
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #16 - March 02, 2013, 01:31 PM
    @happymurtad

    Social psychology in general shows that social influences affect our decisions. Our decision making process is largely unconscious, and culture affects us unconsciously.

    We can't 'reason' our way out of social influence or unrealistic standards that easily (if that were the case then many psychological disorders like body dysmorphic disorder wouldn't be a persistent problem), though we can of course diminish it's influence.

     
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #17 - March 02, 2013, 01:44 PM
    Quote from: strangestdude on March 02, 2013, 01:05 PM
    Women can exercise and diet, they have control over that.

    ^Do we have control over skin conditions, stretch marks, features, height, etc? Having a nice figure isn't the only thing that makes one physically attractive anyway, and even then most sufferers of eating disorders are female. Believe it or not, I'm actually not in the "porn and modelling objectify women, make us feel ugly, and are EVIL as a result" camp. I personally think there's too much noise made about this sort of thing as it is. The word "objectification" gets thrown around an awful lot. I don't think people look at Miranda Kerr or whatever other model and see an object, they see a beautiful woman, and some women see a standard of beauty they should meet. It's not "objectification" as such, and it's a bit pathetic that men are trying to join in on the fun and cry "objectification" now. 

    I also think the fact that there isn't a lot of noise made about "male objectification" speaks for itself tbh  whistling2
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #18 - March 02, 2013, 01:50 PM
    Quote from: zooby on March 02, 2013, 01:06 PM
    Should a man who doesn't attain high social status and employment feel worthless then? That is bullshit, it's not all in his control and the fact that you two suggest it is would only add to the disappointment a man would feel when he inevitably fails.

    There are greater qualities of value that a person can possess rather than their job or looks. It's not to do with the nature of the objectification. It's the objectification itself. It's inherently wrong whether it's happening to women or men.


    Lol, a man? You think women don't feel the same? You think a woman wouldn't feel the same if she didn't attain high school status and employment? You think women don't have pressures to be independent and successful career-wise in this modern world?

    What I said is that the things men are portrayed in media as to have achieved has more room for men to try and achieve (not saying anything on whether that objectification is wrong or right here) whereas a woman and her body...it's more of a stupid thing because genes determine what you will look like, sure you can add a bit of make up and do your hair to fit the social expectations a bit more, but largely you have very little control over compared to working hard to achieve success in your career which has more potential of working out (both for men and women).
    "Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

    'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #19 - March 02, 2013, 02:07 PM
    ^IKR? Since when was it socially acceptable for women to be unemployed, high school drop-outs? 
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #20 - March 02, 2013, 02:17 PM
    And the battle of sexes begins, this is beyond my control so I'm going to remain a spectator

    popcorn
    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #21 - March 02, 2013, 02:34 PM
    Quote from: Al-Alethia on March 02, 2013, 01:44 PM
    ^Do we have control over skin conditions, stretch marks, features, height, etc? Having a nice figure isn't the only thing that makes one physically attractive anyway, and even then most sufferers of eating disorders are female. Believe it or not, I'm actually not in the "porn and modelling objectify women, make us feel ugly, and are EVIL as a result" camp. I personally think there's too much noise made about this sort of thing as it is. The word "objectification" gets thrown around an awful lot. I don't think people look at Miranda Kerr or whatever other model and see an object, they see a beautiful woman, and some women see a standard of beauty they should meet.


    So you argument is that one's individual physiology isn't under one's control.

    But economic 'success' despite being dependent on global logistics is?

    Are you aware of the amount of people who lost their jobs, homes, savings, businesses and are on long term unemployment since '08? Look into it a bit.

    Quote
    It's not "objectification" as such, and it's a bit pathetic that men are trying to join in on the fun and cry "objectification" now.


    Gender issues relating to men are often trivialized by women IME. Same thing I came across when looking into critiques of the porn industry. People influenced by feminist critiques (despite not calling themselves feminists) ignore the problems facing men and transwomen in the industry (the problems for transwomen are worse than for women).

    Look suicide is disproportionate for the male gender. Something is going on in regards to gender identity/gender roles in our culture and is influencing this. Seeing as the media shapes culture, how male identity is portrayed in the media is something that I think needs to be looked at.

    Quote
    I also think the fact that there isn't a lot of noise made about "male objectification" speaks for itself tbh  whistling2


    Feminism probably.

    Gender issues related to males are trivialized, just like you have.

    Paternity fraud (a female phenomenon), young men experiencing a disproportionate amount of violence (along with LGBT), male suicide rates, etc.

    You don't think examining male identity in the media may be important, or should we only focus on how women are treated?

    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #22 - March 02, 2013, 02:36 PM
    Quote from: Stardust on March 02, 2013, 01:50 PM
    Lol, a man? You think women don't feel the same?

     
    Point out a place where I implied that? I was simply responding to Al-Alethia's post where she says for men it's more about "changeable things" whereas for women it's "unchangeable things" so that somehow makes it worse. Which it doesn't.

    Quote
    You think a woman wouldn't feel the same if she didn't attain high school status and employment? You think women don't have pressures to be independent and successful career-wise in this modern world?

     Nope I acknowledge women have these pressures too.

    Quote
    What I said is that the things men are portrayed in media as to have achieved has more room for men to try and achieve (not saying anything on whether that objectification is wrong or right here) whereas a woman and her body...it's more of a stupid thing because genes determine what you will look like, sure you can add a bit of make up and do your hair to fit the social expectations a bit more, but largely you have very little control over compared to working hard to achieve success in your career which has more potential of working out (both for men and women).

     Yes, that's fine but then you said it can be a positive thing for men because it's not about things which they have no control over. I don't think it's as black and white as that and SD explained why.

    Personally I couldn't give a shit what the media portrays as the "desirable" man, but surely people who say women are objectified in the media should acknowledge men have similar pressures also and it's not exclusive to women.
    Join us on chat. Click here.
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #23 - March 02, 2013, 02:43 PM
    @SD: Suicide is attempted more by women, men just do it more successfully.
    "Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

    'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #24 - March 02, 2013, 02:52 PM
    Quote
    @SD: Suicide is attempted MORE by women, men just do it more successfully.


    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/1998/11/981112075159.htm

    Quote
    Although suicide rates are lower among women, women lead men two to one in suicide attempts. So, Murphy says at least 200,000 women are involved in suicide attempts annually. But he points out that attempted suicide most often is not an attempt to actually end one's life. Its purpose, he says, is to survive with changed circumstances.

    "An attempted suicide is not really an attempt at suicide in about 95 percent of cases. It is a different phenomenon. It's most often an effort to bring someone's attention, dramatically, to a problem that the individual feels needs to be solved. Suicide contains a solution in itself," he says.

    In attempted suicide, both men and women tend to use methods that allow for second thoughts or rescue. Murphy says that when people intend to survive, they choose a slowly effective, or ineffective, means such as an overdose of sleeping pills. That contrasts to the all-or-nothing means like gunshots or hanging used by actual suicides.

    In the past, researchers who looked at the high rate of attempted suicide in women concluded that women were just not as efficient as men at taking their own lives. Murphy calls that "sexist baloney" and points to statistics that show that like men, women who commit suicide most often use guns. However, even as the number of women using the most lethal means increases, the suicide rate in women has slowly declined.

    "So it really goes back to the same thing -- that women, when they intend to do it, can be just as effective as men in committing suicide. But they aren't so inclined," Murphy says.


    I actively hate feminism now. It has to be the reason why gender issues related to men are trivialized.
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #25 - March 02, 2013, 03:13 PM
    Quote from: zooby on March 02, 2013, 02:36 PM

    Point out a place where I implied that? I was simply responding to Al-Alethia's post where she says for men it's more about "changeable things" whereas for women it's "unchangeable things" so that somehow makes it worse. Which it doesn't.


    Seriously? It makes it worse because women feel even more powerless to make the changes, and to know it's not very changeable. Any time in your life you can pursue your goals pretty much (youth not required as is with the case of beauty of women) so not only is she bombarded with a narrow idea of 'beauty' there's a limited time as well apparently to achieve this basically unattainable goal.

    Quote from: zooby on March 02, 2013, 02:36 PM

    Yes, that's fine but then you said it can be a positive thing for men because it's not about things which they have no control over. I don't think it's as black and white as that and SD explained why.



    Agree or not? Influences where it gives you drive to work towards creating a career for yourself is in some sense good? I'm not saying the extreme hammering of the idea to 'you're worthless otherwise' is good, but from some angle you can see the positive side to it as long as you can keep perspective.

    Whereas with women focus on something like looks where it's hardly something to 'achieve' it's just an ideal based on a handful of western white female models with certain body types and facial features. So basically you're born with the 'good genes' or you're fucked in that department.

    Quote
    Personally I couldn't give a shit what the media portrays as the "desirable" man, but surely people who say women are objectified in the media should acknowledge men have similar pressures also and it's not exclusive to women.


    I do acknowledge that men do have some pressures from a different angle, but when I replied to SD initially I was talking about why it's hardly talked about and I think it's because of the disproportionate amount of body 'perfection' pressures women have to deal with and the MUCH MORE lack of control they have in this area.

    @SD: Ok, I didn't know that about suicide attempts. It's a bold statement you're making about feminism though...
    "Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

    'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #26 - March 02, 2013, 03:29 PM
    Quote from: strangestdude on March 02, 2013, 09:29 AM
    What do you guys think about male objectification in media?

    I'm happy to respect men as sex objects.
    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #27 - March 02, 2013, 03:46 PM
    Quote
    I'm not saying the extreme hammering of the idea to 'you're worthless otherwise' is good, but from some angle you can see the positive side to it as long as you can keep perspective.

    Whereas with women focus on something like looks where it's hardly something to 'achieve' it's just an ideal based on a handful of western white female models with certain body types and facial features. So basically you're born with the 'good genes' or you're fucked in that department.


    A positive side of the media's standard of beauty is that it encourages women to eat healthy and exercise.

    See what I did there?

    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #28 - March 02, 2013, 03:57 PM
    Quote from: Stardust on March 02, 2013, 03:13 PM
    Seriously? It makes it worse because women feel even more powerless to make the changes, and to know it's not very changeable. Any time in your life you can pursue your goals pretty much (youth not required as is with the case of beauty of women) so not only is she bombarded with a narrow idea of 'beauty' there's a limited time as well apparently to achieve this basically unattainable goal.

     Hmm fair enough, women definitely do have more of those body pressures than men.

    Quote
    Agree or not? Influences where it gives you drive to work towards creating a career for yourself is in some sense good? I'm not saying the extreme hammering of the idea to 'you're worthless otherwise' is good, but from some angle you can see the positive side to it as long as you can keep perspective.

    Whereas with women focus on something like looks where it's hardly something to 'achieve' it's just an ideal based on a handful of western white female models with certain body types and facial features. So basically you're born with the 'good genes' or you're fucked in that department.

    My point is the those "changeable things" like great career, wealth etc. can seem just as unchangeable as your own genes when you're stuck in a dead end job and struggling to get by. It could make you feel equally as inadequate and helpless. OK in a certain light it promotes self improvement but it's a double edged sword IMO.
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  • The Objectification Of Men In Media
     Reply #29 - March 02, 2013, 04:18 PM
    Quote from: strangestdude on March 02, 2013, 03:46 PM
    A positive side of the media's standard of beauty is that it encourages women to eat healthy and exercise.
    See what I did there?

    Some runway models are size zero, and most are underweight, there have also been a few high-profile cases of models who've died of starvation. Hardly "healthy". Also, will eating healthy and exercising make you taller? Or shorter? Or blemish-free? Or forever young? I agree with Stardust that you've made a pretty bold (and unfounded) statement re feminism. The lack of attention given to "male objectification" has nothing to do with feminism and everything to do with the fact that men simply don't give a toss. How many men have come to this thread complaining that they feel objectified? How often do you hear men complaining that they're "objectified" because they're expected to have a job? 

    I can't stand how MRAs blame feminism and women for a range of BS that has nothing to do with us. Why are there no shelters for male victims of domestic violence? I dunno, why don't men work on that. 
    Why are men disproportionately victims of violent crime I dunno, why do men disproportionately commit violent crime? 
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