Why Hijab even exists...

1« Previous thread | Next thread »
- Deserter
- Ex-Muslim
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
OP - March 15, 2015, 11:18 PM

I lately found out that the one and only reason hijab was created was to distinguish free women from slave women in Islam, a tradition of assyrian origin. Apparently women used to get harrased a lot and faced possible rape if she went out to relieve herself during the night. The guy's excuse was always "i thought she was a slave women!"

Turns out in islam the Awra of a slave women is the same as the man's O.o from the navel to the knee i couldn't find an english source (http://entaha.com/%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%A8%D8%B7-%D8%B9%D8%B4%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%A6%D9%8A%D8%A9/%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A3%D8%AF%D9%84%D8%A9-%D8%A3%D9%86-%D8%B9%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%A9-%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A3%D9%85%D8%A9-%D9%81%D9%8A-%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A5%D8%B3%D9%84%D8%A7%D9%85-%D9%85%D9%86-%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B3%D8%B1%D8%A9-%D9%84%D9%84%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%A8%D8%A9)

In islam slave women typically went out bare chested There's plenty of photographs taken in the late 1800's that show it.
https://www.google.co.ma/search?q=%D8%B9%D9%88%D8%B1%D8%A9+%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A3%D9%85%D8%A9&hl=fr&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=NA8GVczELJftaJLFgLgO&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAg&biw=1093&bih=499&dpr=1.25

Like wtf?? O.O There's even a story i read about how Umar ibn al khatab beat up a slave girl for covering herself because she was "mimicking free women" which i found extremely cruel and horrible, like the poor girl must've faced constant sexual harassment or even rape (no one gave a flying fuck if a slave girl got raped) and wanted to cover up to be left alone <.<

But there you go, i think the practice is so ingrained in the muslim collective memory that it resulted in the horrible sexual harassment we face today in the arab world "for not dressing modestly enaugh <.<
- Lilyesque
- The Deconverter
- Pub Regular
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #1 - March 15, 2015, 11:22 PM

Zaotar and Tom Holland should get in here! More evidence of an Assyrian origin of Muhammad and Islam!
- lua
- Ex-Muslim
- Grossly Incandescent
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #2 - March 15, 2015, 11:48 PM

Oh, the hours I've spent debating and scraping together scholarly opinions on the hijab...or should it be a burqa...or can it be a turban...or does it have to be an actual khimar...or does it just mean a non-specific covering for your neck down...or does it just mean cover your breasts...or, wait, do you even have to cover your breasts, because old ladies can walk around with them out for all to see according to the Quran...or does that really mean that?

Yes, the only thing we can be sure of is that it is one of the biggest mistakes playing on extraordinarily basic human psychology that forces women to become their own protectors against sexual acts, and messes people up on a major scale that you see plain as day in Saudi Arabia, where a society exists where people are scribbling out images of women and girls less than 10 years old when they appear on packages to be sold in stores because it might be fitnah and a woman with an uncovered head can stop traffic.

A situation where I have had to hear more than one guy from KSA argue that girls should dress modestly around their fathers because otherwise the fathers might want to rape them, and I had to just say "cool story, bro" instead of calling Child Protective Services and getting his kids taken way the fuck away from him, because he will find sympathizers for his position that the only thing keeping a woman from being raped by any and every man around her is her clothing choices in his country.

It doesn't protect women, it hypersexualizes everything. It's the opposite of what they wanted.
- Skywalker
- Pub Regular
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #3 - March 15, 2015, 11:49 PM

Lilyesque

I was thinking about it the other day when I remembered that slave girls were prohibited from covering their hair.

Quote
Nafe'e narrated that whenever Ibn Umar wanted to buy a slave-girl, he would inspect her by analysing her legs and placing his hands between her breasts and on her buttocks"
Sunnan Al-Kubra, Volume 5 page 329

Imam Al-Baani al-Wahabi termed the tradition as 'Sahih' in his book "Mukhtasir Irwa Al-Ghalil Fi Takhrij Ahadith Manar Al-Sabil" Volume 1 page 355 Hadith number 1792.

This is a quote from another forum.Albani who was the most prominent salafi muhadith in the modern era, classified this hadith as authentic. Really depraved.
- Skywalker
- Pub Regular
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #4 - March 15, 2015, 11:58 PM

Quote
Anas reported: ?Umar once saw a slave-girl that belonged to us (to Anas) wearing a scarf, so Umar hit her and told her: ?Don?t assume the manners of a free woman.?

Musnaf Ibn Abi Shaybah, Volume 2 page 41 Tradition 6236

Imam Ibn Hajar in ?al-Deraya? Volume 1 page 124 and Al-Albani the Salafi in ?Irwa al-Ghalil? Volume 6 page 203 have graded this hadith as ?Sahih?.
- Skywalker
- Pub Regular
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #5 - March 16, 2015, 12:01 AM

Since I don't actually have the books, I can't confirm it. But if Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani classified it as authentic, then it would be most likely considered as such by the religious establishment.
- Deserter
- Ex-Muslim
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #6 - March 16, 2015, 12:09 AM

They're both sahih <.< and even if the girls didn't walk around shirtless they still weren't allowed to cover their arms and hair.
pretty sick stuff o.o
- three
- Ex-Muslim
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #7 - March 16, 2015, 01:38 AM

Quote from: lua on March 15, 2015, 11:48 PM
Oh, the hours I've spent debating and scraping together scholarly opinions on the hijab...or should it be a burqa...or can it be a turban...or does it have to be an actual khimar...or does it just mean a non-specific covering for your neck down...or does it just mean cover your breasts...or, wait, do you even have to cover your breasts, because old ladies can walk around with them out for all to see according to the Quran...or does that really mean that?

Yes, the only thing we can be sure of is that it is one of the biggest mistakes playing on extraordinarily basic human psychology that forces women to become their own protectors against sexual acts, and messes people up on a major scale that you see plain as day in Saudi Arabia, where a society exists where people are scribbling out images of women and girls less than 10 years old when they appear on packages to be sold in stores because it might be fitnah and a woman with an uncovered head can stop traffic.

A situation where I have had to hear more than one guy from KSA argue that girls should dress modestly around their fathers because otherwise the fathers might want to rape them, and I had to just say "cool story, bro" instead of calling Child Protective Services and getting his kids taken way the fuck away from him, because he will find sympathizers for his position that the only thing keeping a woman from being raped by any and every man around her is her clothing choices in his country.

It doesn't protect women, it hypersexualizes everything. It's the opposite of what they wanted.

Yes. It does. That must have been excruciating to sit through.

Don't let Hitler have the street.
- yeezevee
- Pub Regular
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #8 - March 16, 2015, 01:45 AM

Q: Why Hijab even exists...

ans: .. It enhances the beauty of women at the same time it hides the beauty of women ..

IDIOTS......... .. It is child abuse you fools......

well let me hide other pictures

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-G-zLDjz0QlQ/TxR8ThxxVvI/AAAAAAAADJQ/REKdfcya6yA/s1600/baby4.jpg
http://a5.mzstatic.com/us/r1000/026/Purple/2f/36/75/mzl.wfxqcign.png
http://www.islamicblog.co.in/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Beautiful-Muslim-cute-girl-photo.jpg
http://www.shiachat.com/forum/uploads/post-52413-0-81812500-1342075761_thumb.jpg
http://www.shiachat.com/forum/uploads/post-54817-0-30387600-1342705060_thumb.gif

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
- lua
- Ex-Muslim
- Grossly Incandescent
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #9 - March 16, 2015, 01:54 AM

Quote from: three on March 16, 2015, 01:38 AM
Yes. It does. That must have been excruciating to sit through.

The most recent one I thankfully wasn't dealing with firsthand. The husband, who now, against all of my advice, is vocally debating about Islam online, had a Saudi from the cesspools of twitter come talk at him about the merits of modesty and that very subject came up. After the man said that, the husband asked, "Are you saying that if your daughter wasn't fully covered in front of you, you'd want to rape her?" and this fucking guy was like, "Yeah, absolutely," and that's when the husband ran in to my room to rant and rave about it.

The guy was like, "You're a man, you know, when you see a woman you stop thinking logically and you start thinking like an animal and you can't control yourself and anyone who pretends they're not like that is lying." Husband told him he belongs in a jail, and another Saudi blogger, a woman, joined in the conversation at this time and said he was an animal and she hopes his kids are taken away from him.

Loads of fun. When is Mars going to be habitable, again?
- Quod Sum Eris
- King of the
- Pub Regular
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #10 - March 16, 2015, 02:28 AM

I'm liking your husband more and more.

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
- lua
- Ex-Muslim
- Grossly Incandescent
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #11 - March 16, 2015, 02:45 AM

He's a good guy.
- Bolton34
- Ex-Muslim
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #12 - November 08, 2015, 11:24 PM

I hate the hijab and cringe whenever non-Muslims valorise it as fashion or praise it if they see Muslim children as young as 5 wearing it.

This makes me want to ask them to stop and reconsider what they're doing, because among the Muslim community the hijab is generally used to make women less desirable to men, and on children it's a form of sexualising them. They might be like, "Rubbish!" but this is the truth.

I appreciate they want to be more understanding towards those they view as minorities, but doing this only creates more harm than good.
- ExMuslimVlogGuy
- Ex-Muslim
- Ex-Super Salafi
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #13 - November 21, 2015, 04:12 AM

I used to hang out with Salafis. I remember this one weird guy in particular. This was my "moderate Salafi" phase where we would occasionally sin and watch movies in the theater.

This one Salafi was telling me that he cannot hang out in public ever because of the women.. Or else he'd masturbate all day. All the other brothers could so we wondered why he couldn't. We told him to "lower his gaze" like a good muslim.

I talked to him for 3 hours and his conclusion was that "other men's desires weren't as strong as his." He was unemployed, lazy, and childish.

So he'd lock himself in his apartment all day.

There's definitely something wrong with the Muslim men.

"If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
"Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
"Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
- Quod Sum Eris
- King of the
- Pub Regular
- offline
Why Hijab even exists...
Reply #14 - November 21, 2015, 05:15 AM

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
1« Previous thread | Next thread »