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Theme Changer

 Topic: My Article in the Guardian

 (Read 3908 times)
  • 1« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • My Article in the Guardian
     OP - December 16, 2015, 12:37 PM

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/dec/16/muslims-faith-isis-religion-islam

    Smiley
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #1 - December 16, 2015, 12:54 PM

    An excellent and well-balanced article  Afro
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #2 - December 16, 2015, 02:20 PM

     Afro
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #3 - December 16, 2015, 02:43 PM

    A great step forward.  Afro

    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #4 - December 16, 2015, 06:37 PM

    I love you, Hassan, and I love this idea and want to see it gain momentum. The more I think about this, the more I realize that there is not going to be One Response that will have to take root in order to challenge literal interpretations. Instead, it will require multiple ones.

    For those drawn to Islamism as a political ideology, I think the work of Maajid Nawaz, Qulliam, and the like will be key in having those ideas challenged and refuted.

    For those drawn to Islam’s theological truth claims, which then become a gateway into literalism and (in some case) violent interpretations, the work of Ex-Muslims and the sorts of videos and articles you were instrumental in creating will continue to prove essential.

    For those interested in Islam from the standpoint of a spiritual or social identity, an identity often preyed upon by extremists, I think the Agnostic Muslim movement provides some really great insight and incentive and offers a needed alternative.

    And of course, there’s no need to draw clear lines of distinction between these efforts, either. That would be a mistake. Plurality of opinion and thought is what is needed, as diverse sets of individuals will find what works best for them in different ways.

    These are just my random thoughts as I think through my own relationship with Islam.

    I’d noticed several weeks ago a post by Maajid Nawaz addressed to his “anti-theist” friends in which he questioned in what alternate reality Muslims would end up apostatizing en masse. The quote rubbed me the wrong way for a moment, because I thought of how equally unlikely it would be for Muslims to suddenly reinterpret Islam en masse because someone else told them to do so.

    But then I realized, getting “Muslims” to do anything, especially en masse, should never be the goal. Instead, we should all be honest and open about what works for us, and why. As more people share those ideas and experiences, the worst ideas will find themselves challenged and endangered. That’s a huge part of the reason I’m excited to see the reception you’ve been getting.

    And, one more random thought on this quote:

    “The Qur’an is not the speech of God, just as the loaf of bread is not the work of the farmer. God produced the raw material, which was inspiration, just as the farmer produces the raw material, which is wheat. But it is the baker who turns the wheat or flour into bread according to his own unique way, artistic expertise and creative ability. Thus it is the Prophet who was responsible for interpreting the inspiration and turning it into actual phrases and words according to his own unique view.”

    The only problem that I see with this analogy is that in it the baker never emphatically claims – with the threat of eternal torture and damnation for his doubters – that he was actually the one who also grew and produced the wheat. If he did, we’d have to spend a great deal of time at least calling the baker’s integrity (or sanity) into question. Then we could say, “yeah, he was either crazy or lying some of the time, but he sure made some pretty damn good bread when he put his mind to it.” Grin
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #5 - December 16, 2015, 06:45 PM

     <3
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #6 - December 16, 2015, 06:47 PM

    I sent my article to one friend and he sent me back Mehdi Hasan's article: "The last thing Islam needs is a Reformation"

    *roll eyes*
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #7 - December 16, 2015, 07:01 PM




    Quote


    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #8 - December 16, 2015, 08:21 PM

    Some positive comments beneath the article...
    Quote
    Best thing on the internet today. Thank you.

  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #9 - December 16, 2015, 08:31 PM

    I sent my article to one friend and he sent me back Mehdi Hasan's article: "The last thing Islam needs is a Reformation"

    *roll eyes*


    Mehdi doesn't want to give up belief in his flying horse. He loves it.

    "If you don't like your religion's fundamentalists, then maybe there's something wrong with your religion's fundamentals."
    "Demanding blind respect but not offering any respect in reciprocation is laughable."
    "Let all the people in all the worlds be in peace."
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #10 - December 16, 2015, 08:32 PM

    Is The Guardian website down?
    It's up now.
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #11 - December 17, 2015, 12:37 AM

    Mehdi doesn't want to give up belief in his flying horse. He loves it.

    Mehdi really is a bit thick (or entirely ignorant of history).

    'In recent months, cliched calls for reform of Islam, a 1,400-year-old faith, have intensified.'

    Newest faith on the block apart from the bonkers American sub-cults.

  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #12 - December 17, 2015, 01:02 AM

    I sent my article to one friend and he sent me back Mehdi Hasan's article: "The last thing Islam needs is a Reformation"
    *roll eyes*

    I do hope the weather isn't damp where he is at. His straw man could get mouldy.

    I did not at all see where your article was recommending an Islamic Oliver Cromwell. I did detect hints of a Muslim Enlightenment, which is to say a revival of the Mutazila.
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #13 - December 17, 2015, 02:55 AM

    Hassan, I really hope I get the chance to meet you in real life one day so I can buy you a pint.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #14 - December 17, 2015, 02:59 AM

    Great article !   Afro


    Quote
    This is why religion must evolve and change with that understanding. Religion that doesn’t change is not religion.

     


    I can already here them screaming "bidaah !! "


     

    In my opinion a life without curiosity is not a life worth living
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #15 - December 17, 2015, 03:01 AM

    Hassan, I really hope I get the chance to meet you in real life one day so I can buy you a pint.

     

    You both live in Britain right ?

    Is Hassan's farm really far from your city ?

    In my opinion a life without curiosity is not a life worth living
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #16 - December 17, 2015, 07:16 AM

    I saw this first from the facebook group!  dance dance


    Hassan, this is great!!! Wooo Islamic reform is taken seriously now!!  dance dance

     Afro
  • My Article in the Guardian
     Reply #17 - December 17, 2015, 09:48 AM



    You both live in Britain right ?

    Is Hassan's farm really far from your city ?


    Not so far away that Hassan may never log onto CEMB and get a PM from me saying I'm in the area. If that does happen, his first few rounds will be on me. Afro

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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