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 Topic: Muhammad got a Man to Divorce his Beloved Wife coz his Dad Disliked her!

 (Read 3709 times)
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  • Muhammad got a Man to Divorce his Beloved Wife coz his Dad Disliked her!
     OP - May 28, 2009, 07:39 AM

    Look at this hadith from Sunan Abu Dawud- Kitab al Adab

    5119  Narrated Abdullah ibn Umar: A woman was my wife and I loved her, but Umar hated her. He said to me: Divorce her, but I refused. Umar then went to the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) and mentioned that to him. The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Divorce her

    This is sooo wrong! Flaming mad

    The man & his wife were deeply in love 001_wub, which is what matters! Why should they have to divorce just because the woman's father in law disliked her?

    In fact, this is a lovely love story, a couple in love  hugs & trying to stay together despite a wicked, disapproving father in law trying to tear them apart  Old geezer & insisting that the man divorce his wife, but the loving husband refusing to do anything of the sort! nyanya

    Then comes Mo, who claims to be Allah's Messenger & thus his words carry great weight & orders the poor couple to divorce! no

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: Muhammad got a Man to Divorce his Beloved Wife coz his Dad Disliked her!
     Reply #1 - May 28, 2009, 10:45 AM

    I'm a bit sceptical of this. I've seen a couple of fatwas where they tell the husband that it is not ok to divorce your wife because your parents say so. I have a feeling this one is out of context.
  • Re: Muhammad got a Man to Divorce his Beloved Wife coz his Dad Disliked her!
     Reply #2 - May 28, 2009, 01:02 PM

    I'm a bit sceptical of this. I've seen a couple of fatwas where they tell the husband that it is not ok to divorce your wife because your parents say so. I have a feeling this one is out of context.


    This site also mentions it& mentions other hadiths by Muhammad which contradict it.

    Quote
    This article will be short and to the point. According to certain narratives Muhammad censured anyone who would cause a man to divorce his wife, even if that person happens to be a slave:
    Chapter 31. The Divorce Performed By A Slave
    2081. It was narrated that Ibn ?Abbas said: "A man came to the Prophet and said: ?O Messenger of Allah, my master married me to his slave woman, and now he wants to separate me and her.? The Messenger of Allah ascended the pulpit and said: ?O people, what is the matter with one of you who marries his slave to his slave woman, then wants to separate them? Divorce belongs to the one who takes hold of the calf (i.e., her husband).?" (Da?if) ?
    b. Divorcing is a husband?s right, whether he is free or is a slave. NONE has the right to force him to separate from his wife. (English Translation of Sunan Ibn Majah - Compiled by Imam Muhammad Bin Yazeed Ibn Majah Al-Qazwini, From Hadith No. 1783 to 2718, Ahadith edited and referenced by Hafiz Abu Tahir Zubair 'Ali Za'i, translated by Nasiruddin al-Khattab (Canada), final review by Abu Khaliyl (USA), [Darussalam Publications and Distributors, First Edition: June 2007], Volume 3, The Chapters on Divorce, pp. 193-194; capital emphasis ours)
    As a sidenote, pay attention how Muhammad again disparages women by likening to animals, to chattel which men possess. With that said notice that, despite being classified as weak, Muslim scholars still derived a valid principle with reference to this narration. For example, according to the commentary Muhammad?s statements make it emphatically clear that absolutely no one has the right to force a person to leave his wedded spouse.
    Yet Muhammad goes against his own directives and forces a man to divorce a woman he loves and sets a pattern for others to emulate by compelling husbands to divorce their spouses:
    Chapter 36. A Man Whose Father Orders Him To Divorce His Wife.
    2088. It was narrated that ?Abdullah bin ?Umar said: "I had a wife whom I loved, but my father hated her. ?Umar mentioned that to the Prophet and he ordered me to divorce her, so I divorced her." (Hasan) ?
    2089. It was narrated from ?Abdur-Rahman that a man?s father or mother ? Shu?bah (one of the narrators) was not sure ? ordered him to divorce his wife, and he made a vow that he would free one hundred slaves if he did that. He came to Abu Darda? while he was praying the Duha, and he was making his prayer lengthy, and he prayed between Zuhr and ?Asr. Then he asked him, and Abu Darda? said: "Fulfill your vow and honor your parents." Abu Ad-Darda? said: "I heard the Messenger of Allah say: ?(Honoring) one?s father may lead one to enter through the best of the gates of Paradise; so take care of your parents, (it is so, whether you take care of them) or not.?" (Hasan) (Ibid., 198-199)
    It sure seems that, in trying to please his companions, specifically Umar, Muhammad had no qualms about going against his own directives and breaking his own principles.
    Muhammad was truly a man who failed to practice what he preached time and time again, a person so fickle and double-minded that he ended up passing on contradictory directives to his community as a result of it. The truly sad thing about this is that he blamed God for all his mistakes and constant change of mind.


    Fatwa sites say its not okay to divorce your wives because your parents say so, it would be okay if Rasulullah said so.

    I really can't find any context other than Muhammad trying to please Umar, can you find another context?  Huh?

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: Muhammad got a Man to Divorce his Beloved Wife coz his Dad Disliked her!
     Reply #3 - May 28, 2009, 01:14 PM

    That is strange. As far as I know the divorce cannot be carried out unless the fathers reasons for it are legit (as in she does something unIslamic or whatever). Even for Mo's standards this hadith just doesn't fit. I have a feeling that the fathers reason weren't stated in these hadiths, they're not exactly 100% reliable. I have seen some others that aren't entirely in context either.
  • Re: Muhammad got a Man to Divorce his Beloved Wife coz his Dad Disliked her!
     Reply #4 - May 28, 2009, 01:21 PM

    That is strange. As far as I know the divorce cannot be carried out unless the fathers reasons for it are legit (as in she does something unIslamic or whatever). Even for Mo's standards this hadith just doesn't fit. I have a feeling that the fathers reason weren't stated in these hadiths, they're not exactly 100% reliable. I have seen some others that aren't entirely in context either.


    Can you find the context? I couldn't. I'd be glad if you did.

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: Muhammad got a Man to Divorce his Beloved Wife coz his Dad Disliked her!
     Reply #5 - May 28, 2009, 01:27 PM

    I cant and I wouldn't be surprised if the proper context doesn't exist.
  • Re: Muhammad got a Man to Divorce his Beloved Wife coz his Dad Disliked her!
     Reply #6 - May 28, 2009, 03:54 PM

    I cant and I wouldn't be surprised if the proper context doesn't exist.


    Well, in the absence of a context, Mo's acts seem arbitrary & evil-not to mention inconsistent, Umar was one of his most important companions, I wonder whether this was pre hijrah or post hijrah?

    Pre hijrah, he had few followers so he needed to keep them happy with him, maybe thats' why he insisted that Umar's son divorce his wife.

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: Muhammad got a Man to Divorce his Beloved Wife coz his Dad Disliked her!
     Reply #7 - May 28, 2009, 05:14 PM

    I found an IslamQA fatwa on divorcing a wife on parents' orders, which also speaks of Umar asking his son to divorce his wife.

    Quote
    Man divorcing his wife on his parents? orders

    What is the shar?i ruling on a man divorcing his wife when his parents tell him to, on the grounds that this wife used to work for them as a servant in the past? Is this regarded as disobeying one?s parents? Please note that this wife currently lives an honourable life.

     
    Praise be to Allaah.   
    Undoubtedly the parents are those who are most deserving of respect, obedience and kind treatment. Allaah mentions the command to treat parents well alongside the command to worship Him as He says (interpretation of the meaning):
    ?And your Lord has decreed that you worship none but Him. And that you be dutiful to your parents?
    [al-Isra? 17:23]

    Obedience to parents is obligatory on the child with regard to that which will benefit them and will not harm the child. With regard to that which does not bring them any benefits or which will cause harm to the child, he does not have to obey them in that case.

    Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah (may Allaah have mercy on him) said in al-Ikhtiyaaraat (p. 114): A person is obliged to obey his parents with regard to that which is not sinful, even if they are immoral evildoers? This has to do with that which is beneficial for them and not harmful to him.


    Divorce with no acceptable reason is something that is hated by Allaah, because it destroys the blessings of marriage and exposes the family to destruction and the children to loss. It may also involve injustice towards the woman. The fact that the wife had been a servant in the past is not a legitimate reason for divorce, especially if she is religiously-committed and has a good attitude.

    Based on this, he does not have to obey his parents and divorce his wife, and that is not regarded as being disobedient towards them. But the son should express his refusal to divorce her in a kind and gentle manner, because Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
    ?say not to them a word of disrespect, nor shout at them but address them in terms of honour
    [al-Isra? 17:23]

    Shaykh Muhammad ibn Saalih ibn ?Uthaymeen (may Allaah have mercy on him) was asked about the ruling on a man divorcing his wife if his father tells him to do that. He said:
    If the father tells his son to divorce his wife, one of the following two scenarios must apply:
    1 ? Where the father gives a legitimate reason why he should divorce her and separate from her, such as saying, Divorce your wife because her behaviour is suspicious, such as she flirts with men or goes out to gatherings that are not decent and so on. In this case the son should agree and divorce her, because he is not telling her to divorce her on the basis of a whim, rather that is to protect his son?s honour from being besmirched, so he should divorce her.

    2 ? Where the father tells his son to divorce his wife because the son loves her, but the father feels jealous of his son?s love for her and the mother is more jealous, because many mothers, when they see that their son loves his wife, feel very jealous, as if the son?s wife is a co-wife and rival. We ask Allaah to keep us safe and sound. In this case the son does not have to divorce his wife if his father or mother tells her to divorce her. Rather he should be tactful with them and keep his wife, and he should try to convince them with kind words until they are persuaded that she should stay with him, especially if the wife is religiously committed and has a good attitude.

    Imam Ahmad (may Allaah have mercy on him) was asked about this very issue. A man came and said: ?My father is telling me to divorce my wife.? Imam Ahmad said to him: ?Do not divorce her.? He said: ?Didn?t the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) tell Ibn ?Umar to divorce his wife when ?Umar told him to do that?? He said: ?Is your father like ?Umar??

    If the father quotes evidence to his son and says, ?O my son, the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) told ?Abd-Allaah ibn ?Umar to divorce his wife when his father ?Umar told him to do that,? the response to that is: ?Are you like ?Umar?? But you should speak kindly and gently, and say that ?Umar saw something which indicated that it was in his son?s interests to divorce his wife. This is the answer to this question which comes up frequently.
    Al-Fataawa al-Jaami?ah li?l-Mar?ah al-Muslimah, 2/671.

    The Standing Committee for Issuing Fatwas was asked about a mother telling her son to divorce his wife for no reason or fault in her religious commitment, rather it was because of the mother?s personal reasons. They replied as follows:
    If the situation is as described, that his wife is righteous and he loves her, and she is dear to him, and she does not behave badly towards his mother, and his mother only dislikes her for personal reasons, then he should keep his wife and stay married to her. He does not have to divorce her in obedience to his mother, because it was proven that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: ?Obedience is only with regard to that which is right and proper.? Based on this, he should honour his mother and uphold ties of kinship with her by visiting her and spending on her, and paying attention to her needs and making her happy and pleasing her in whatever ways he can, apart from divorcing his wife.


    Look at the legitimate reasons when a son should divorce his son on his father's orders!  finmad

    Quote
    Where the father gives a legitimate reason why he should divorce her and separate from her, such as saying, Divorce your wife because her behaviour is suspicious, such as she flirts with men or goes out to gatherings that are not decent and so on. In this case the son should agree and divorce her, because he is not telling her to divorce her on the basis of a whim, rather that is to protect his son?s honour from being besmirched, so he should divorce her.

     

    Isn't it the couple's choice as to how they should lead their lives?Why does a father in law have a right to object at all, provided the daughter in law isn't say a serial killer?

     A woman can be divorced simply for flirting with other men or going to indecent gatherings, while a man may take four wives!

    While the fatwa asks the son to say, "Are you like Umar," implying that Umar was someone special compared to other Muslim fathers' in law, it is still not mentioned what Umar's unfortunate daughter in law did to merit a divorce!

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: Muhammad got a Man to Divorce his Beloved Wife coz his Dad Disliked her!
     Reply #8 - May 29, 2009, 09:56 AM

    Yeh shaadi nahin ho sakti !!!!!  finmad

    Pakistan Zindabad? ya Pakistan sey Zinda bhaag?

    Long Live Pakistan? Or run with your lives from Pakistan?
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