Who are easier to convert out of Islam

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- Saif Rahman
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Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
OP - August 19, 2009, 09:32 AM

Quote from: pakman on August 18, 2009, 10:20 PM
I find the women in my family are much harder to convince, they seem to have a stronger emotional attachment to Islam

Quote from: IsLame on August 18, 2009, 10:22 PM
Yeah, women being generally less rational than men are normally harder to convince that there is no God

Quote from: BerberElla on August 19, 2009, 08:03 AM
What?

Firstly, wrong, but secondly, you don't need to leave Islam for purely rational reasons, you can leave for emotional ones too.

I find it easier to convince women than men, because I don't go down the rational route anyway, I appeal to their emotions since islam squashes them in ways I know I can use to get them to see what they need to see.

I find men harder to convince because they get far more out of Islam, than a woman does. Infact why should a man leave Islam at all since he gets 4 wives, total obediance, doesn't need to cover up like a woman, has free choices to a certain extent? how many "cavemen" would find that appealing?

Hmm, maybe because you are a man you find convincing men easier, as I do with women, interesting.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #1 - August 19, 2009, 09:35 AM

I second Ella.

Women have more to gain and less to lose.
It is Men who stand to lose alot, why leave Islam when you get it all? They have the upper hand.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #2 - August 19, 2009, 09:38 AM

I think men can do it easier, especially because women who are married or live under their fathers couldn't dare announce apostasy if they wanted to-but with a man they could make a new life without being hassled too much from the Islamic community

I know it's not the same question, but I think this is a big factor, I have known people who went back to Islam simply because they couldn't pull off being a secret apostate.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #3 - August 19, 2009, 09:41 AM

Quote from: FinallyFree on August 19, 2009, 09:38 AM
I have known people who went back to Islam simply because they couldn't pull off being a secret apostate.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #4 - August 19, 2009, 09:58 AM

It is strange enough that in our part of the world Women indeed are the more difficult to convince. I have tried several times to reason with Muslims and the women were the most difficult ones despite the fact that they benefit the least from the religion of Islam.

http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=6122.0

...
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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #5 - August 19, 2009, 10:18 AM

Quote from: RIBS on August 19, 2009, 09:58 AM
It is strange enough that in our part of the world Women indeed are the more difficult to convince. I have tried several times to reason with Muslims and the women were the most difficult ones despite the fact that they benefit the least from the religion of Islam.

I have found that too, in fact if you look at the membership here I guess that male:female ratio is favoured towards men. How many men have partners that are still muslim, yet does the reverse apply to the same degree?

In response to Berb's post, I think you are right that you are more likely to get a positive response to criticism if you respond to their emotions, whereas with men I think on the whole its about reason.
Quote from: Meredith on August 19, 2009, 09:35 AM
I second Ella.

Women have more to gain and less to lose.
It is Men who stand to lose alot, why leave Islam when you get it all? They have the upper hand.

The men here are testamount to this being a false conclusion to draw. Just because it favours you, it does not make it right if you base your understanding on reason and proves that it can be just as wrong, whoever benefits.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #6 - August 19, 2009, 10:21 AM

It's not male to women in the divide, it's emotional to rational that creates the divide, and both men and women can be either one of those things.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #7 - August 19, 2009, 10:27 AM

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #8 - August 19, 2009, 10:33 AM

The fact that you keep implying reason and rationality are mostly the area of men, it's not true.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #9 - August 19, 2009, 10:38 AM

No, that not what I was saying. I think there are women who apply reason & rationality too, some more than men.

On the whole, and as you said earlier, I believe appealing to their emotions is a better tactic to employ with women, whereas with men you are more likely to get success with logic.

On a separate note I find there is a certain type of women that it is nigh on impossible to convert, those that like to feel there is someone looking over them. And again logic is rarely going to work on this group.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #10 - August 19, 2009, 10:48 AM

Oh yes, couldn't agree more, after all if as a young girl you are raised to expect a man to take care of you, you will always need a man to take care of you until you realise how futile giving away your identity is in the long run.

Anyway I prefer deconverting women simply because I am more successful at emotional arguements and other women will always identify at some level with other women, you know, like a sisterhood type thing. Not always, some women are generally apathetic about life too.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #11 - August 19, 2009, 01:26 PM

The male to female ratio always seems to favour men when it comes to ex-muslim forums. In fact a theology forum I visit has a lot more male atheists than female. I wonder why we don't have more females. Maybe females are less likely to discuss such things. I'm quite we're more religious in general too.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #12 - August 19, 2009, 01:31 PM

I always fiind men are easier to persuade about the futility of religion. Probably because I more with men. But women I find are more emotioanally attached to religion for many reasons. They are brought up inculcated in a dependency syndrome; They see themselves as guarding the family honour, ensuring traditions are passed on from generation to generation; They fear for their children thinking if they blaspheme Allah bad things could happen their children; They tend to have much trials and tribulations and strangely such things make their faith stronger.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #13 - August 19, 2009, 01:39 PM

I just can not identify with that kind of woman, I've never had an emotional attachment to Islam, I have seen men more emotionally attached, and yet some statistics to show women as being more religious than men, which is so alien to me.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #14 - August 19, 2009, 01:51 PM

I think men can easier convert out of Islam...
I can go and travel to anywhere I want. Only questions my parents will ask is when I get back and if I need money.
My 15 year old sister has to go through a whole interview before she leaves and when she gets back... xD
So women do have more reason to apostatize.

"I have seen men more emotionally attached, and yet some statistics to show women as being more religious than men, which is so alien to me."
It all has to do with fear for whatever comes after this life...

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #15 - August 19, 2009, 01:52 PM

You're on of the lucky ones!

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #16 - August 19, 2009, 01:53 PM

Quote from: BerberElla on August 19, 2009, 01:39 PM
I just can not identify with that kind of woman, I've never had an emotional attachment to Islam, I have seen men more emotionally attached, and yet some statistics to show women as being more religious than men, which is so alien to me.

Yep, perhaps men are more emotionally attached to the clique of Islam, and women more emotionally attached to the concept of God?

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #17 - August 19, 2009, 01:54 PM

Could be, worth pondering on anyway.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #18 - August 19, 2009, 04:51 PM

IMO For most personality types, when you talk to a man, you have to appeal to what quantifiable damage islam is taking from him.

Yes you can get 4 wives and beat her up whenever she talks back, but in islamic countries, men on average get 1.1 sexual partner in their lifetime. You are not getting laid in islam.

Yes society needs to have order and a common focus, but show me which islamic country, today or centuries ago, achived a common order that you will want to move to.

Men needs to realize the gains offered to them are not as rosy as advertized and that there exists an alternative.

With women, i am a bit stumped, perhaps Berbs can post couple concrete examples?

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #19 - August 20, 2009, 10:29 PM

I think women are harder to convince, but not because women are stupid or something, but because most muslim women are controlled with an iron grip by their families. Men have a certain degree of freedom, for instance, I came home about 5 hours late last night and my mom said, "call next time!" and dropped the subject. Last week my sister was late by literally 15 minutes. Literally 15 minutes. She was yelled at and punished. When she goes out, she has to write an essay explaining her plans.

I think women are more likely to not leave islam only because of the extreme danger in doing so. I notice with my sister that shes slyly voicing doubts about islam, and shes 4 years younger than I was when I first did...so it definetely has nothing to do with gender, but what happens if you are of a certain gender.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #20 - August 20, 2009, 10:53 PM

@Diem
Sounds like your family is the same as my family... xD
Give your sister a little "push" when she looks like she doubts islam.
Try to let her know that she can trust you with stuff like that...
Maybe she'll become an apostate too ^^

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #21 - August 20, 2009, 11:32 PM

i wonder if a guy has ever converted to islam because he couldnt get laid?...

...so conversion - his new mates find him a sheila - quick wedding - bed the chick - divorce - leave islam...lol!
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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #22 - August 20, 2009, 11:40 PM

Quote from: Diem on August 20, 2009, 10:29 PM
I think women are harder to convince, but not because women are stupid or something, but because most muslim women are controlled with an iron grip by their families. Men have a certain degree of freedom

Good point, men are less constrained by social constraints and norms from birth and that applies to cultures outside of Islam too.

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Re: Who are easier to convert out of Islam - men or women?
Reply #23 - August 20, 2009, 11:48 PM

Quote
Good point, men are less constrained by social constraints and norms from birth and that applies to cultures outside of Islam too.

I think social pressures and stigma also play a part in this. Morals are so tied in with the notion of religion and god that when a woman apostates, it is seen as a blemish or that it's a sign of being a loose character. Or in the west it is seen as an excuse for women who might have an "inferiority complex" when it comes to the freedom that non-muslim girls enjoy.
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