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 Topic: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!

 (Read 5625 times)
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  • Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     OP - September 12, 2009, 11:29 PM

    I had this debate on IslamFactor.org right now, about why & how women form majority in Hell.

    This is the debate!


    http://islamfactor.org/index.php?showtopic=5909&view=getnewpost

    What do you think?

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #1 - September 13, 2009, 08:13 AM

    I had this debate on IslamFactor.org right now, about why & how women form majority in Hell.

    This is the debate!


    http://islamfactor.org/index.php?showtopic=5909&view=getnewpost

    What do you think?



    Rashna, that guy (Jim), might as well have said "Allah knows best". The answers he has given are simply preaching to the choir. He is forgetting that he's facing someone who doesn't believe in islam. Although your approach is useful, I have often found that it might not work with some people. You have to remember that this guy has certain first premise on which he is building his arguments. His premise is the following:-

    1 - God exists.

    2- Mo is his messenger.

    3 - The Quran is the word of god.

    4 - The hadith are words and sayings of Mo.

    As an atheist I would start at the very beginning and ask him to formulate a coherent definition of God based on reason alone. These guys usually take their definition from religious scriptures and try to formulate from their. But remember, scripture based argument is based on the assumption that God exists. We are not obliged to take their scripture based arguments because they are all rival scriptures claiming to be the word of God. Even as an agnostic this method would work. They really need to demonstrate:-

    1 - The existence of God

    2 - Why a theist and not a deist or pantheist version?

    3 - From all the religions why Islam?

    When arguments from hadith and verses are presented, you have to remember that they will have explanations already worked out, no matter how absurd they are, simply because it's a given to them, that Mo is a prophet. They really have to cross the first and second hurdle successfully.

    Also hadith was compiled more than two centuries after the death of Mo and there was a whole load of it for them to sift through. They obviously had to try to make sense of all the conflicting narrations that came through to them. Hence why there is all the interpretations and trying to fit hadith into certain scenarios that the prophet faced. It still doesn't alter the fact that those statements are attributed to the prophet and that they are spoken words. It's fairly obvious that those things which would on the face of it look crude, would need to be justified somehow. Their attempts are merely trying to square the circle.

    Anyhow after my little rant, I must say that you have done well. That admin on the forum is really trying to avoid the issue by throwing rules and regulations at you. The debate is squarely in your hands and the ball is in his court to justify the reasons thoroughly.
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #2 - September 13, 2009, 08:45 AM

    Thanks Omar, I'll start out like that!   Smiley

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #3 - September 13, 2009, 08:57 AM

    Thanks Omar, I'll start out like that!   Smiley


    No worries Afro
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #4 - September 13, 2009, 09:31 AM

    I had this debate on IslamFactor.org right now, about why & how women form majority in Hell.

    This is the debate!


    http://islamfactor.org/index.php?showtopic=5909&view=getnewpost

    What do you think?




    I thought you disliked this site Rashna? You seemed pretty busy slagging it off.

    Ha Ha.
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #5 - September 13, 2009, 09:50 AM

    Good to see you back Rashna! And Jack, get off her case will ya.

    Religion - The hot potato that looked delicious but ended up burning your mouth!

    Knock your head on the ground, don't be miserly in your prayers, listen to your Sidi Sheikh, Allahu Akbar! - Lounes Matoub
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #6 - September 13, 2009, 10:39 AM

    Nice to see you back Rashna. We really miss your nice posts.

    ...
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #7 - September 13, 2009, 10:46 AM

    On the subject:

    Has the Judgment day started yet? How come Mohammad saw women in Hell? Already?
    I mean how come he sees hell before it started? or was that a dress rehearsal thingy? Huh?

    ...
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #8 - September 13, 2009, 10:48 AM

    On the subject:

    Has the Judgment day started yet? How come Mohammad saw women in Hell? Already?
    I mean how come he sees hell before it started? or was that a dress rehearsal thingy? Huh?


    I think it might mean a glimpse into the future or a prophesy.
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #9 - September 13, 2009, 11:22 AM


    I thought you disliked this site Rashna? You seemed pretty busy slagging it off.


    I guess I too will have to leave(again!) like Zaephon!  Tongue

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #10 - September 13, 2009, 11:32 AM

    Thought you had. As for the 'Zionist Crusader', good luck to him.

    Ha Ha.
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #11 - September 13, 2009, 01:35 PM

    Quote from: Jack Torrence
    Thought you had. As for the 'Zionist Crusader', good luck to him.


    I am a proud Zionist Crusader as well!  bunny

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #12 - September 13, 2009, 02:44 PM

    Good for you.

    Ha Ha.
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #13 - September 13, 2009, 03:46 PM

    I don't know about this topic i read your debate. I think you did well but I'm Muslim so I do have my own bias as well, however from what I know I agree with Omar Khayyam as I think the Prophet Muhammad was prohesising someting that will happen or a vision he saw so he used it to encourage the women to be more respectful and grateful to their husbands.

    "The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims. The most perfect slaves are, therefore, those which blissfully and unawaredly enslave themselves."
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #14 - September 13, 2009, 04:16 PM

    So you say that a guy who lived 1400 years ago still choses how women behave?! Just because he said he had a vision about it? Or even better, because you believe that he had a vision he never talked about?


    lets see... Aaaaah... Yes, i hear you God... yes, all women shall from now on never wear clothes again. I will spread the message.


    So, i just got a message from god, he changed his mind. All women have to be completly naked from now on.


    Prove me wrong...

    "We are never deceived, we deceive ourselves." - from Goethes Faust
    "Only the wisest and the stupidest men never change." - Confuzios
    "there is no religion of peace, only people who are peaceful while being religious."
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #15 - September 13, 2009, 04:20 PM

    I don't know about this topic i read your debate. I think you did well but I'm Muslim so I do have my own bias as well, however from what I know I agree with Omar Khayyam as I think the Prophet Muhammad was prohesising someting that will happen or a vision he saw so he used it to encourage the women to be more respectful and grateful to their husbands.


    I was merely quoting based on what the muslims assume. Not that I'm in agreement with what Muhammed said.
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #16 - August 18, 2010, 07:53 AM

    Hmm, random necro..............Thinking hard

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #17 - August 18, 2010, 08:01 AM

    I think she's just advertising women's dresses (link in her sig.), maybe?  Huh?

    "Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

    'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #18 - August 18, 2010, 08:02 AM

    Oh lol missed that.  015

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #19 - August 18, 2010, 08:04 AM

    Makes me want to go shopping, I havn't been shopping in ages, no money *sigh*  Cry

    "Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

    'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #20 - August 18, 2010, 08:13 AM

    Makes me want to go shopping, I havn't been shopping in ages, no money *sigh*  Cry


    Embarrassed  I'm a shopoholic lol infact I'm off out now to do yet more shopping, with yet more money that I don't really have.  Grin  bills......shmills.

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #21 - August 18, 2010, 08:59 AM

    Embarrassed  I'm a shopoholic lol infact I'm off out now to do yet more shopping, with yet more money that I don't really have.  Grin  bills......shmills.


    Haha, shopaholics ftw! I get such a rush from buying clothes that I think are gorgeous, when it's mine, especially when I'm home with the shopping lol.

    "Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

    'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #22 - August 18, 2010, 09:32 AM

    I should get myself a girl like you, so she can drag me to shop for my clothes cause I just can't be bothered ^_^

    Do not look directly at the operational end of the device.
  • Re: Debate on IslamFactor.org-on more women in Hell!
     Reply #23 - August 21, 2010, 03:09 AM

    Just looking at part of that discussion, which I do think is nonsense, the hadiths should be taken with a pinch of salt and are not really reliable then. If that particular hadith is taken with a pinch of salt the same has to be said for the rest of them.
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