So you're saying you got a lot out of it?
Oh that was awesome Os.
I love all this cynical snooting of the nose over a situation you know fuck all about. Are you scared the PC demon will come and get you?
My'friend worked out that his first sexual experience, which, set the course for his sexuality for the next twenty years of his life, was not really how he felt deep down. He's now happily married with kids. Again, I apologise if this kind of story is not allowed in PC World (ha!) it just happens to be the case, and I was merely commenting on it. I know a couple of gay people who agree that first sexual encounters shape the way they are, some that say 'no, not true' and plenty more who say 'I don't fucking know'. Not my fault if you have a prob with that.
Hold on a fuckin sec, Jack. No one's saying that sexual encounters as a child cannot affect adult sexual orientation. Islame looked like he was heading that direction, but then I posted this on the previous page:
Actually, if you believe sexual orientation occurs on a spectrum, and that where one finds themselves on the spectrum is at least partially influenced by social norms, then it's not a ridiculous idea that someone could switch orientations, although I'd think people going from a 0 to a 5 on the Kinsey scale out of choice or environmental reasons is highly unlikely.
Being molested as a kid definitely can have an effect on your later sexual orientation and practices.
Still, I think the book is sending a bad message because they guy who wrote it wants to turn gay kids straight, which means you think there's something wrong about being gay. I don't think respect for the rights of homosexuals and treating them as you'd treat anyone else is dependent on someone's sexual orientation being a result of nature rather than nurture, inborn traits rather than choice. Actually, I think focusing on the whole nature end of it can lead to an essentially "but they can't help it" argument for gay rights, which I think is kind of demeaning.
And NO ONE thus far has objected to it. I can think of some forums I used to post on or even some real-life scenarios where I would have been skewered by the PC Mafia for this statement and labeled a homophobe, and yet no one here even raised an objection that being molested as a child or other environmental factors could possibly lead to same-sex orientation/practices later in life. If people here were really being PC about it, I would have been mercilessly attacked for expressing such an opinion.
The issue is not whether or not a scenario as described in the book could happen or not-- the issue is that the guy who wrote the book thinks that gay kids need to be "fixed" into being straight.
Although I can't speak for Jack's friend, I will speak from a psychological perspective. Sexuality is a complex thing. Our mind is very complex. It can be conditioned to believe in anything. So in regards to sexuality, any first time sexual experience can condition a tiny child into thinking that a certain sexual behavior is okay. So if a child is sexually molested, he/she can be programmed to believe that having sex with older men is fine--it's normal.
In terms of homosexuality, that's also true--and it can also work the other way. A homosexual can be conditioned to believe that heterosexuality is the only sexual orientation when later on during the individual's life he/she finds out that he/she is actually gay--then embrace it.
Regards to this book, since Q didn't point the publisher until a later post than the OP, I saw the book representing a real case scenario.
The truth of the matter is that sexual orientation is both natural, and learned. And I use the term 'learned' here to mean 'programmed.' For example, when I see these "gay deconverts" go back to being straight, it doesn't surprise me. Because psychologically speaking, it can happen...it does happen. Likewise, I've seen gays walk into this "gay deconversions" and walk out still embracing their homosexuality.
It does represent a real case scenario. Apparently this happened to the book's author. And he's since built a very successful career as a family/psychological counselor selling his services to Christian bigot parents who want to "fix" their gay kids. A real American success story.
That's the fuckin problem. The larger agenda this author/counselor is serving-- the idea that there is something "wrong" with being gay. If the end result of counseling regarding same-sex child sexual abuse is that someone decides that his/her sexual orientation was affected by that encounter and, after coming to terms with it, they want to move further up the Kinsey scale, okay, fine. But making someone not gay shouldn't be the goal-- healing them should be, if reorienting their sexuality is part of that healing process, okay, but it shouldn't be forced, because, first of all, there's nothing wrong with being gay, and secondly, it's possible the kid, even if sexually abused by someone of the same-sex, woulda been gay or bisexual anyhow. And it's not like this dude is ONLY counseling kids who were victims of sexual abuse who became gay-- he's counseling any gay kid who's parents bring them in to get "fixed"-- which is highly unethical and exactly why he got booted out of the American Counseling Association
Topic: Disturbing children's book