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Theme Changer

 Poll

  • Question: What is your position on smoking bans?
  • -Outlaw smoking and tobacco production - 4 (15.4%)
  • -Ban smoking in ALL places except private residence - 2 (7.7%)
  • -Ban smoking in enclosed public places and work places (status quo in the UK) - 4 (15.4%)
  • -Introduce a system of quotas in which every town council allocates a number of permits for smoking bars, restaurants, and coffee shops - 5 (19.2%)
  • -Ban smoking only in enclosed public areas. Allow private institutions (restaurants, bars, shopping centres..etc) to do as they wish - 9 (34.6%)
  • -Lift all smoking bans except in hospitals - 0 (0%)
  • -Lift all smoking bans - 2 (7.7%)
  • Total Voters: 26

 Topic: Smoking bans

 (Read 5679 times)
  • Previous page 1 2« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #30 - March 04, 2010, 11:47 PM
     Cheesy

    What is it James? why all this unfriendliness? seriously?

    I'm not picking on you. I read it, thought about it, found it logically unsound, and pointed that out. This is the definition of a discussion. I'm not here to score points or anything.

    Again, I honestly can't understand the antagonism.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #31 - March 04, 2010, 11:49 PM
    James is sexually frustrated after making a pass at his sister and getting rejected. She's just so closed-minded!

    Hahah, just kidding you know I love you james.  Afro
    Quote from: thinkfree on September 28, 2010, 07:58 PM
    Iblis has mad debaterin' skillz. Best not step up unless you're prepared to recieve da pain.

  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #32 - March 05, 2010, 12:11 AM
    My daughter's 8 year old friend's locker stinks of tobacco, from second hand smoke. It's from her parents at home. It is a mild form of child abuse I suppose.
    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable and I'm just ferocious. I want your heart. I want to eat your children. Praise be to Allah." -- Mike Tyson
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #33 - March 05, 2010, 12:24 AM
    Of course it is and so is taking your child to McDonald's 5 times a week.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #34 - March 05, 2010, 12:26 AM
    Quote from: Iraqi Atheist on March 05, 2010, 12:24 AM
    so is taking your child to McDonald's 5 times a week.


    Jesus Submissive-Bob.. you do that? You fucking asshole I hate you so much. I bet you just want to make ur kids fat so they don't play around so much so you can sit on the couch and watch the Bachelor. I hate you SB. I hate you.
    Quote from: thinkfree on September 28, 2010, 07:58 PM
    Iblis has mad debaterin' skillz. Best not step up unless you're prepared to recieve da pain.

  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #35 - March 05, 2010, 12:37 AM
    The only person I would take to McDonalds 5 times a week is my mother-in-law, and thats only because she had a coronory by-pass last month.
    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #36 - March 05, 2010, 12:40 AM
    Quote from: z10 on March 04, 2010, 11:43 PM
    my friend, freedom does not equate anarchy.
    If a coffee shop labels itself as a smoking institution then everybody entering into that place is complicit in the understanding that there will be second hand smoke around, and that's exactly how a free world should operate. Nobody will be forced inside the coffee shop.


    The comparison that I was meaning to make was that these places are open to the public and anybody murdering in these premises would be harming others. Similarly, anybody smoking in these premises will be harming others. What if the owner of a shopping centre was to declare that it is permissable to smoke on their premises?
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #37 - March 05, 2010, 12:44 AM
    As long as they label their shopping centre as smoking areas and people are informed before they go in then there is no problem whatsoever. If you still decide to go in once seeing the smoking sign then you are agreeing to be in that environment. If you don't want to, then go to a different shopping centre.

    As I said, private institutions should set their own rules. Ruling out smoking in public places I can understand but a private location should not be dictated to.
    At evening, casual flocks of pigeons make
    Ambiguous undulations as they sink,
    Downward to darkness, on extended wings. - Stevens
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #38 - March 05, 2010, 12:49 AM
    Could you elaborate? You can have a property that is both privately owned and open to the public.
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #39 - March 05, 2010, 12:54 AM
    Well, every property that is privately owned is technically open to the public but only when the owner agrees to it.
    At evening, casual flocks of pigeons make
    Ambiguous undulations as they sink,
    Downward to darkness, on extended wings. - Stevens
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #40 - March 05, 2010, 01:01 AM
    And what if the smoking ban was repealled and every private place that is open to the public (all coffee shops, restaurants, shopping centres) became smoking areas to the point that anybody who didn't want to inhale second hand smoke had to drink their coffees outside? Would you even speak out against it? Or would you just passively shurg your shoulders and say "whatever people wanna do with their private property".
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #41 - March 05, 2010, 01:03 AM
    of course, there is a reason why private property is private. It is the owner's right to do whatever they want.

    Besides, that's not going to happen. Only about a quarter of the world smokes (extrapolating from UK figures) so it seems unlikely that every single private establishment will become smoking.
    At evening, casual flocks of pigeons make
    Ambiguous undulations as they sink,
    Downward to darkness, on extended wings. - Stevens
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #42 - March 05, 2010, 01:09 AM
    Consumers will ultimately determine the percentage.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #43 - March 05, 2010, 01:13 AM
    I guess in this particular instance, the tug of desires of every member of society will cause everything to fall into place harmoniously. I suspect that's the mode of thinking the anarchist adopts. I can appreciate anarchism, I really can. Sometimes I sympathize with it. But in the end I think that in practice not everything will fall into place harmoniously, rather some things will turn into chaos.

    I'm not saying you're idea of private property being truly private is anarchical, my mind is just pre-occupied with anarchism lol.
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #44 - March 05, 2010, 01:15 AM
    I can understand that james, humanity is immature, chaotic, panicky. However, the way I see it is that mankind has never before been given a chance to live as freely and as maturely, there has always been some form of authority to which the majority has bowed. Perhaps mankind will take to it naturally, we cannot know until we try it, and try it we must because it would be such a beautiful creative society if it works.
    At evening, casual flocks of pigeons make
    Ambiguous undulations as they sink,
    Downward to darkness, on extended wings. - Stevens
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #45 - March 05, 2010, 01:25 AM
    Sometimes I think it would be creative, but sometimes I think everything might just stop dead. Even though most things are crap when driven solely by profit, there is at least some good things, and the reason we have those few good things is because of the whole capitalistic machine that makes everything move/ gives people a reason to wake up in the morning, etc...

    Also, what would you do with hundreds of murderers on your hands with no prisons to put them in? That's my most significant concern.
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #46 - March 05, 2010, 01:46 AM
    I've changed my mind. I'm going with 5.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #47 - March 05, 2010, 01:47 AM
    Quote from: Iblis on March 05, 2010, 12:26 AM
    Jesus Submissive-Bob.. you do that? You fucking asshole I hate you so much. I bet you just want to make ur kids fat so they don't play around so much so you can sit on the couch and watch the Bachelor. I hate you SB. I hate you.


    It's actually makes it easier to slip them into their clothes in the morning because they literally sweat grease.
    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable and I'm just ferocious. I want your heart. I want to eat your children. Praise be to Allah." -- Mike Tyson
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #48 - March 05, 2010, 07:46 AM
    I cannot understand why people smoke around babies. I mean really, to see mothers smoking infront of their toddlers, is sickening. Asthma, bronchitis, and respiratory and ear infections increase in children of smokers.

    Cigarette smoking not only encourages lung cancer and heart disease, it also badly affects your skin and hair..Nicotine is a diuretic; so smoking causes drying of the surface of the skin.It reduces the vitamin A levels in the skin. Also damages brain as brain is connected to the heart and the lungs through arteries. These arteries supply oxygen and other chemicals to the brain. So, when a person smokes cigarette, the chemicals inhaled are sent to the brain. Tooth. Tobacco smoke can also cause gum disease, tooth decay and bad breath.
     Cigarette smoking causes 87 percent of lung cancer deaths and is responsible for most cancers of the larynx, oral cavity and pharynx, esophagus, and bladder.

    Why is this crap even legal?

    In new born babies: It retards growth. Smoking stunts the growth of the developing fetus. Nicotine narrows the uterine blood vessels, thus reducing blood flow to the baby. Also, smoking puts the oxygen blocker carbon monoxide into the blood that nourishes baby. Carbon monoxide robs oxygen from the baby.
    Passive smoking also harms the baby. When expectant mothers are exposed to smoke from other people's cigarettes, their babies are also exposed

    I would vote for option 1. I dont understand why is there a "need" to smoke, inspite of all those health consequences not only risks the health of smokers but also of second hand smokers as well as "third" hand smokers (those who end up with residues of smokes that seemingly came from nowhere into their houses)


  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #49 - March 05, 2010, 07:50 AM
    Man I'm glad the people who set the smoking laws are a tad more liberal than you.  lipsrsealed

    You would take away a persons freedom to choose just because you don't understand the choice.
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #50 - March 05, 2010, 07:55 AM
    ^What about the persons or children for that matter,  freedom to choose NOT TO SMOKE that second hand smoke or third hand residues? What about their health rights to choose NOT to inhale those nicotinous air?
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #51 - March 05, 2010, 07:59 AM
    Err first off, non smokers are already protected from second hand smoke in every frakken establishment in the UK, and quite frankly almost every smoker I know, smokes outside of their own houses if they happen to live with an adult non smoker.

    The same for their kids, I don't know anyone who smokes around their kids, I've lost count of the amount of days spent huddling, shivering in the back garden.

    You make it sound like all smokers are poisoning non smokers, without any kind of thought to the many many responsible smokers, who are more than happy to not force second hand smoke down some non smokers throat.

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #52 - March 05, 2010, 10:48 AM
    Berbs, isnt the family an "institution" too? I read on the news about this woman who kept having baby after baby and during pregnancy she smokes and drinks to her hearts content. A number of her children have physical defects. Call me what you like but I'd love nothing more than to see her "personal freedoms" "violated".  grin12

    Hey, VegetarianSoul how's persuading everyone that they're actually herbivores going?
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #53 - March 05, 2010, 11:57 AM
    Quote from: J4m3z on March 05, 2010, 10:48 AM
    Berbs, isnt the family an "institution" too? I read on the news about this woman who kept having baby after baby and during pregnancy she smokes and drinks to her hearts content. A number of her children have physical defects. Call me what you like but I'd love nothing more than to see her "personal freedoms" "violated".  grin12

    Hey, VegetarianSoul how's persuading everyone that they're actually herbivores going?


    This is a bit of a joke isn't it?  when I used the defects arguement as to why incest should remain illegal, you dismissed it as a valid arguement and yet now you wish to use that same arguement here?  wacko

    Are ALL babies born to a smoking mother, born with defects or healthy issues?  NO.

    Same as with the incest breeding arguement.  If the risk was minimal enough for you to wish legalization for incest, I find it funny that you would violate a smokers personal right for those same reasons.

    Thousands and thousands of women quit smoking during pregnancy, are you saying their responsible attitude to smoking and children should be punished, for the selfishness of other smokers?

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #54 - March 05, 2010, 01:15 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on March 05, 2010, 11:57 AM
    This is a bit of a joke isn't it?  when I used the defects arguement as to why incest should remain illegal, you dismissed it as a valid arguement and yet now you wish to use that same arguement here?  wacko


    What are you talking about? Incestual sex and incestual reproduction are two different things. It's only Catholics who think sex and reproduction are one and the same thing.

    Quote
    Are ALL babies born to a smoking mother, born with defects or healthy issues?  NO.


    Here we go, the all or nothing argument for accounting of evidence  Roll Eyes

    A mother is allowed to smoke and drink during pregnancy unless it is proven that 100% of her offspring will be born with defects as a result? You can't be serious...

    Quote
    Same as with the incest breeding arguement.  If the risk was minimal enough for you to wish legalization for incest, I find it funny that you would violate a smokers personal right for those same reasons.


    As far as I am aware, there is a far far higher chance of children being born of smoking/drinking mothers with defects than children being born from an incestuous couple.

    Quote
    Thousands and thousands of women quit smoking during pregnancy, are you saying their responsible attitude to smoking and children should be punished, for the selfishness of other smokers?




    Sorry, what is this punishment for responsible mothers you are talking of?  wacko
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #55 - March 07, 2010, 05:18 AM
    Quote
    Ban smoking only in enclosed public areas. Allow private institutions (restaurants, bars, shopping centres..etc) to do as they wish

    This seems reasonable. Smokers shouldn't be allowed to blow secondhand smoke at bystanders in public places, but telling private businesses what to do seems like a step too far. Let them decide for themselves, and customers will vote accordingly with their wallets. The majority of businesses will probably end up banning it anyway due to consumer demand.

    I'll never be able to understand how people can become smokers, knowing the risks. It strikes me as stupid. Hopefully it'll be on its way out within a few decades.
    You need to read this book.
  • Re: Smoking bans
     Reply #56 - March 07, 2010, 06:41 AM
    Unfortunately I don't think smoking will go away, and I think there will be more smokers. My mom doesn't smoke and neither does my dad, but my moms side of the family smokes like fucking CHIMNEYS its ridiculous. I mean how the fuck can one smoke that much and waste all that money on smokes?
    "The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never worshiped anything but himself."
    ~Sir Richard Francis Burton

    "I think religion is just like smoking: Both invented by people, addictive, harmful, and kills!"
    ~RIBS
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