All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!

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All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
OP - March 24, 2010, 11:44 AM

Comments left on my video "100% Proof Islam is True?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-AZ6if0Qlw

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well... thats only shows how ignorant you are really...why we should lie about Islamic sciences achivements, there are prouf of it and can be checked... there are even exhibitions about it in Europe.

you keep mentioning the Greeks and the Romans..but how do you explain the West have to translate arabic books, they where studying in Arabic Universities to get the knowedge that started the renaissance... told you already google and check... its easy to dont stay stupid as you are.

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vaccination:
The technique of inoculation was not invented by Jenner and Pasteur but was devised in the Muslim world and brought to Europe from Turkey by the wife of the English ambassador to Istanbul in 1724. Children in Turkey were vaccinated with cowpox to fight the deadly smallpox at least 50 years before the West discovered it.

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surgical instruments:
modern surgical instruments are of exactly the same design as those devised in the 10th century by a Muslim surgeon called al-Zahrawi. His scalpels, bone saws, forceps, fine scissors for eye surgery and many of the 200 instruments he devised are recognisable to a modern surgeon. In the 13th century.

Muslims doctors also invented anaesthetics of opium and alcohol mixes and developed hollow needles to suck cataracts from eyes in a technique still used today.

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camera:
The first person to realise that light enters the eye, rather than leaving it, was the 10th-century Muslim mathematician, astronomer and physicist Ibn al-Haitham. He invented the first pin-hole camera after noticing the way light came through a hole in window shutters. The smaller the hole, the better the picture, he worked out, and set up the first Camera Obscura (from the Arab word qamara for a dark or private room).

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i can go further to show you even your daily basses like eating, drinking coffee, cleaning... comes from islamic world centeries ago.

Ali ibn Nafi, known by his nickname of Ziryab (Blackbird) came from Iraq to Cordoba in the 9th century and brought with him the concept of the three-course meal - soup, followed by fish or meat, then fruit and nuts. He also introduced crystal glasses (which had been invented after experiments with rock crystal by Abbas ibn Firnas.
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #1 - March 24, 2010, 12:16 PM

That's it! I am converting to Islam post haste!

Brilliant thread title btw.
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #2 - March 24, 2010, 12:22 PM

How do the achievements of Muslim scientists centuries after the advent of Islam prove that Islam is the right religion?

Religion - The hot potato that looked delicious but ended up burning your mouth!

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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #3 - March 24, 2010, 01:04 PM

It works like this:

1) All the scientific knowledge before Islam is primitive and imprecise.
2) All the scientific knowledge developed during Islamic Golden Age (on top of already existing science) is an important cornerstone to humanity.
3) The fact that many of those scientists/mathematicians/philosophers during Islamic Golden Age were considered apostates is not relevant.
4) All the scientific knowledge developed by kuffar and based on "Islamic Science" is of minimal contribution and doesn't really matter.

Conclusion: Allah is great.

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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #4 - March 24, 2010, 02:03 PM

Quote from: Tlaloc on March 24, 2010, 01:04 PM
It works like this:

1) All the scientific knowledge before Islam is primitive and imprecise.
2) All the scientific knowledge developed during Islamic Golden Age (on top of already existing science) is an important cornerstone to humanity.
3) The fact that many of those scientists/mathematicians/philosophers during Islamic Golden Age were considered apostates is not relevant.
4) All the scientific knowledge developed by kuffar and based on "Islamic Science" is of minimal contribution and doesn't really matter.

Conclusion: Allah is great.

That's how Islamic logic works.

We need to have a thread that's exclusively for Muslim Youtube comments.

Some comments that I've gotten:

ahmeedin (1 month ago)
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dats distortion n misrepresenatation of ibn kathir's views. n yes it was in da west dat mass mader was pionered n perfected,u min u hvnt read about da 'reign of terror' in revolutionary france? 70 milllion hindus muderd by muslims,dats acheap fiction gve me another one

ahmeedin (1 month ago)
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wata adepraved charlatan u r, u mention banu qurayza but dd u even botherd to ascertain da authenticity of dat account? is it multiply attested in da authenticated hadiths? wea were da bodys of 900 jews burried? dd da prophet do it? abwt subjugation yeah i thnk its muslims hu hav anihilated 2 million babies in iraq n afghanistan,chechnya,bosnia, n palestine.crackpot u r

ahmeedin (1 month ago)
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indeed u r abig mouth charalatn. now u shifted to da progrom of granada, afictious propaganda dat has no historical basis whatsover n is only found in da histry books of da zionist richard gotheill n mayer keyserling, i challenge you to cite me ascholarly historian who suports ds liars. also see barnard lewis views on da isue

True to historical revisionist form!
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #5 - March 24, 2010, 02:15 PM

Nobody is denying that there were muslims who did contribute to science. We would be silly not to accept that they did. But they are missing the point. How on earth does their contribution validate Islam or that Allah/God exists! It's a non-sequitor. The works of Aristotle or even the pre-Socratic Greeks doesn't prove that the Olympian gods existed!
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #6 - March 24, 2010, 02:37 PM

Quote from: Hassan on March 24, 2010, 11:44 AM
why we should lie about Islamic sciences achivements, there are prouf of it and can be checked... there are even exhibitions about it in Europe.

This comment just shows how these kinds of 'boost the self esteem of Muslims' programmes, exhibitions and agendas, implemented in teh aftermath of 9/11 and 7/7, which are meant to counteract the negative publicity that Islam attracts, by whitewashing Islam, actually are taken by pracitisng Muslims as sanctioned dawah for Islam. It gets taken as another sign of Islam's supremacy. The lack of humility is staggering, but then you remember......this is a Muslim fanatic.

"we can smell traitors and country haters"

Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
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Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #7 - March 24, 2010, 02:43 PM

Reminds me of several great mathematicians who were absolute piss tanks when it came to loving the odd bottle or two of wine.

Like so many other parts of the world I wouldn't be surprised if ones religion played a role in whether one received a grant or not for a given piece of research.

I find it funny how there are claims by some Muslims that a person is a Muslim, they did something good therefore it is the result of Islam.

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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #8 - March 24, 2010, 02:46 PM

Quote from: Zebedee on March 24, 2010, 02:03 PM
ahmeedin (1 month ago)
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dats distortion n misrepresenatation of ibn kathir's views. n yes it was in da west dat mass mader was pionered n perfected,u min u hvnt read about da 'reign of terror' in revolutionary france? 70 milllion hindus muderd by muslims,dats acheap fiction gve me another one

ahmeedin (1 month ago)
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wata adepraved charlatan u r, u mention banu qurayza but dd u even botherd to ascertain da authenticity of dat account? is it multiply attested in da authenticated hadiths? wea were da bodys of 900 jews burried? dd da prophet do it? abwt subjugation yeah i thnk its muslims hu hav anihilated 2 million babies in iraq n afghanistan,chechnya,bosnia, n palestine.crackpot u r

ahmeedin (1 month ago)
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indeed u r abig mouth charalatn. now u shifted to da progrom of granada, afictious propaganda dat has no historical basis whatsover n is only found in da histry books of da zionist richard gotheill n mayer keyserling, i challenge you to cite me ascholarly historian who suports ds liars. also see barnard lewis views on da isue

Regardless of the content of his comments.... WHY is he talking like this?? Why why why is he trying to sound like a ghetto moron?

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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #9 - March 24, 2010, 02:49 PM

Quote from: Tlaloc on March 24, 2010, 01:04 PM
It works like this:

1) All the scientific knowledge before Islam is primitive and imprecise.
2) All the scientific knowledge developed during Islamic Golden Age (on top of already existing science) is an important cornerstone to humanity.
3) The fact that many of those scientists/mathematicians/philosophers during Islamic Golden Age were considered apostates is not relevant.
4) All the scientific knowledge developed by kuffar and based on "Islamic Science" is of minimal contribution and doesn't really matter.

Conclusion: Allah is great.

Exactly. But more specifically, all the technological and scientific advances and discoveries of the West were only made possible because of Islam, and this is a conspiracy of denial to deny Islam parity, and humiliate the Islamic world. Also, Islamic scientists operated in a vacuum, not as part of the ebb and flow of human civilisation, learning off each other. Therefore, the civilisations of polytheists and kuffars, like the ancient Hindus in India with their mathematics, or the Chinese, do not exist.

Islam is supreme, Allah-hu-Akbar

"we can smell traitors and country haters"

Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #10 - March 24, 2010, 02:53 PM

Quote from: Omaar Khayaam on March 24, 2010, 02:15 PM
It's a non-sequitor. The works of Aristotle or even the pre-Socratic Greeks doesn't prove that the Olympian gods existed!

ha! Gold star for you today, Omar

The point though is that its only partially about the existence of Allah. Its also about asserting the primacy, supremacy and exceptionalism of the imperium of Islam, that the Ummah is the source of all that is good in human civilisation and knowledge, that it has been conspired against, and that it shall rise again. That is the other impulse of it, the imperial reflex is always either at the surface, or close to the surface when it comes to this kind of thing.

"we can smell traitors and country haters"

Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #11 - March 24, 2010, 02:54 PM

Because he is a gangsta wannabe jihadi crackhead retard with an inferiority complex. And because he is so fucking tough. You feel me homie? One love!
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #12 - March 24, 2010, 02:55 PM

Quote from: billy on March 24, 2010, 02:37 PM
This comment just shows how these kinds of 'boost the self esteem of Muslims' programmes, exhibitions and agendas, implemented in teh aftermath of 9/11 and 7/7, which are meant to counteract the negative publicity that Islam attracts, by whitewashing Islam, actually are taken by pracitisng Muslims as sanctioned dawah for Islam. It gets taken as another sign of Islam's supremacy. The lack of humility is staggering, but then you remember......this is a Muslim fanatic.

I don't know about that.

Is a cultural exhibit of Muslim medieval architecture, miniature art, ceramics, metal works and scientific tools really white-washing Islam? I love this islamic cultural and historical exhibits and I'm still a big fan the artistic and scientific elements of medieval muslim civilization. Is this some sort of crime now? Do we have to take anything about islamic civilization and culture are apply an ideological lense to it?

I'm against either white-washing or erm.. "mud" washing things when it comes muslim history. I think there are two kinds of narratives and revisionism at work here. An islamist revisionism and an islamophobic one - either is taking one element of reality and stretching it to the extreme. I prefer to accept muslim history how it was, with all its flaws and qualities.

Quote from: thinkfree on September 28, 2010, 07:58 PM
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #13 - March 24, 2010, 02:57 PM

Quote
Is a cultural exhibit of Muslim medieval architecture, miniature art, ceramics, metal works and scientific tools really white-washing Islam? I love this islamic cultural and historical exhibits and I'm still a big fan the artistic and scientific elements of medieval muslim civilization. Is this some sort of crime now? Do we have to take anything about islamic civilization and culture are apply an ideological lense to it?

When it fails to contextualise them and is basically dawah fodder then yes, it is whitewashing. And there has been plenty of that in the UK over the last few years, I can't sepak about Canada.

"we can smell traitors and country haters"

Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #14 - March 24, 2010, 02:59 PM

Quote from: Iblis on March 24, 2010, 02:55 PM
An islamist revisionism and an islamophobic one - either is taking one element of reality and stretching it to the extreme. I prefer to accept muslim history how it was, with all its flaws and qualities.

The trouble is, people deem anything that tells the truth and 'examines the flaws' about Islamic civilisation as being 'Islamophobic'.

"we can smell traitors and country haters"

Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #15 - March 24, 2010, 03:00 PM

I'm a bit surprised. You seriously believe showcasing the purely materialistic things like architecture, and arts is a propaganda just because it happens to be Muslim? I think that's getting into FFI/Rashna territory. Bit worried there.

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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #16 - March 24, 2010, 03:02 PM

No, but it sometimes is used for propaganda purposes.

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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #17 - March 24, 2010, 03:05 PM

Okay then. Should we also ban all exhibits displaying all the achievements of white western civilization? After all, they are fodder for the stormfront types because it gives them proof of the superiority of white culture? Perhaps also ban all exhibits displaying the wonders of Chinese arts and culture, wouldn't want to give those commies a propaganda platform!

You see the problem I have with this way of thinking? Why not just let our historical artifacts and achievments be exactly that, historical. If some dawah shit head wants to use it to promote his ideological worldview thats not really the museum's fault is it?

Quote from: thinkfree on September 28, 2010, 07:58 PM
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #18 - March 24, 2010, 03:10 PM

Besides, I think really delving into and educating people about muslim history and civilization can be a very secularising influence. Medieval muslims scholars and leaders and artists and poets were the total opposite of what the dawaghandists are. They were largely secular, open-minded and ecclectic individuals. How on earth does an exhibit on, say, Omaar Khayaam's poetry in any way support the agenda of the Islamists? If anything, muslim medieval history is totally dominated by culturally liberal, heretical and homoerotic characters.

If anything a genuine and authentic display of medieval muslim civilization would be totally *against* the islamist agenda!

Quote from: thinkfree on September 28, 2010, 07:58 PM
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #19 - March 24, 2010, 03:11 PM

Quote
Okay then. Should we also ban all exhibits displaying all the achievements of white western civilization? After all, they are fodder for the stormfront types because it gives them proof of the superiority of white culture? Perhaps also ban all exhibits displaying the wonders of Chinese arts and culture, wouldn't want to give those commies a propaganda platform!

You see the problem I have with this way of thinking? Why not just let our historical artifacts and achievments be exactly that, historical. If some dawah shit head wants to use it to promote his ideological worldview thats not really the museum's fault is it?

The comparisons are not relevant. First of all, nobody said anything about banning any exhibitions. Secondly, you miss the point - these are propaganda exercises that actively whitewash and tell the partial story, and they are thought of and proudly used as dawah-ganda by Muslims.

"we can smell traitors and country haters"

Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
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Reply #20 - March 24, 2010, 03:12 PM

I'm currently reading Lost History: The Enduring Legacy Of Muslim Scientists, Thinkers, And Artists , along with my Egyptian Muslim penpal. It's a pretty good book. I don't think it is promoting any idea of Muslim superiority. More it is saying "look we were not barbarians and made contributions to civilization too." It openly acknowledges that "Muslim" science was often a continuation of science from previous cultures. It's mostly Astronomy and Math sciences. Of course I do reject the label of "Muslim" science.

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Reply #21 - March 24, 2010, 03:13 PM

Quote from: Iblis on March 24, 2010, 03:00 PM
I'm a bit surprised. You seriously believe showcasing the purely materialistic things like architecture, and arts is a propaganda just because it happens to be Muslim? I think that's getting into FFI/Rashna territory. Bit worried there.

Look, its not about exhibitions or programmes that neutrally display for example, the architecture of Persia. Its about programmes and exhibitions that have an agenda to assert the exceptionalism of Islamic civilisation. It does happen, and criticising them, and noticing how they are used by 'all your basses belong to us' type Islamic supremacists is nothing to do with Rashna.

"we can smell traitors and country haters"

Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #22 - March 24, 2010, 03:13 PM

Quote from: billy on March 24, 2010, 03:11 PM
Secondly, you miss the point - these are propaganda exercises that actively whitewash and tell the partial story, and they are thought of and proudly used as dawah-ganda by Muslims.

What exactly is the "other" side of the "story" to tell when you have an exhibition about medieval muslim ceramics or the complex designs of astrolabes?

Quote from: thinkfree on September 28, 2010, 07:58 PM
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #23 - March 24, 2010, 03:15 PM

Quote from: billy on March 24, 2010, 03:13 PM
Look, its not about exhibitions or programmes that neutrally display for example, the architecture of Persia. Its about programmes and exhibitions that have an agenda to assert the exceptionalism of Islamic civilisation. It does happen, and criticising them, and noticing how they are used by 'all your basses are covered' type Islamic supremacists is nothing to do with Rashna.

Perhaps I'm thinking of very different educational exhibits. Could you point me to a specific example of an institution like a museum promoting the idea of exceptionalism?

Quote from: thinkfree on September 28, 2010, 07:58 PM
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Reply #24 - March 24, 2010, 03:17 PM

Quote
Okay then. Should we also ban all exhibits displaying all the achievements of white western civilization?

What do you mean "also"? Nobody has banned anything, nor called for it. I'm just pointing out that such things are sometimes used for dawaganda purposes.

Quote
Why not just let our historical artifacts and achievments be exactly that, historical. If some dawah shit head wants to use it to promote his ideological worldview thats not really the museum's fault is it?

But I think we can use an ex-muslim forum to point out what the dawa shitheads do, no?

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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #25 - March 24, 2010, 03:17 PM

Quote
What exactly is the "other" side of the "story" to tell when you have an exhibition about medieval muslim ceramics or the complex designs of astrolabes?

I just answered that in my last post - there is a distinction between things like this, and propaganda exercises and programming that feed into a narrative of the decline and fall of Islamic exceptionalism.

"we can smell traitors and country haters"

Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #26 - March 24, 2010, 03:17 PM

Quote from: Cheetah on March 24, 2010, 03:17 PM
What do you mean "also"? Nobody has banned anything, nor called for it. I'm just pointing out that such things are sometimes used for dawaganda purposes.

But I think we can use an ex-muslim forum to point out what the dawa shitheads do, no?

+ 1

"we can smell traitors and country haters"

Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #27 - March 24, 2010, 03:22 PM

Quote from: Submissive Bob on March 24, 2010, 03:12 PM
I'm currently reading Lost History: The Enduring Legacy Of Muslim Scientists, Thinkers, And Artists , along with my Egyptian Muslim penpal. It's a pretty good book. I don't think it is promoting any idea of Muslim superiority. More it is saying "look we were not barbarians and made contributions to civilization too." It openly acknowledges that "Muslim" science was often a continuation of science from previous cultures. It's mostly Astronomy and Math sciences. Of course I do reject the label of "Muslim" science.

It's not so much "muslim" science but it was a culture of learning and sciences during the period of 800s-1300s that was common across one specific segment of humanity known as "muslim civilization". No different than saying the sciences of the 1700s-1900s was a product of "european civilization". To me its not so much a religious label as it is a civilizational one, after all most of these scientists had a couple of things in common - they were muslim and their language of discourse was arabic or persian. This is why a common "muslim" label is applied to them. They were part of the same class of scholars where one could move from central asia all the way to spain and find the exact same language and scientific/intellectual establishment.

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Reply #28 - March 24, 2010, 03:24 PM

A lot of 'Muslim' science and philosophy was itself developed from other non-Islamic sources. Ibn Rushd was influenced by the works of Aristotle. Islamic astronomy developed and improved upon the Ptolemaic model of the solar system.

A lot of the great scientists of the Muslim empire, like Avicenna, were Persian. And Persia of course had an ancient civilisation that was scientifically advanced before the time of Islam.

Even a lot of Islamic art isn't strictly Islamic, rather it came from cultures and places that were incorporated into the Islamic empire as it expanded.

When people look at the Caliphate they think that Islam must have been the source of this advancement in science and civilisation. Islam played a part, but more important was the influence of specific individuals who happened to be Muslims. There's nothing about Islam or being a Muslim that necessitates that someone's going to be some kind of polymath.
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Re: All Your Bases Are Belong to Us!
Reply #29 - March 24, 2010, 03:25 PM

Quote from: Cheetah on March 24, 2010, 03:17 PM
What do you mean "also"? Nobody has banned anything, nor called for it. I'm just pointing out that such things are sometimes used for dawaganda purposes.

Sure, it is. But should we really be held hostage by that? Should I deny my admiration for works of our ancestors because some dawah fuck wants to use it for his purposes? Should you deny the achievements of the enlightenment because a stormfronter uses it to show the superiority of white culture?

My only point is just because we have modern dipshits using historical facts for propaganda, doesn't mean those historical facts should be diminished.

Quote from: thinkfree on September 28, 2010, 07:58 PM
Iblis has mad debaterin' skillz. Best not step up unless you're prepared to recieve da pain.
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