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Theme Changer

 Poll

  • Question: Who will you vote for?
  • Labour - 1 (2.8%)
  • Conservative - 4 (11.1%)
  • Liberal Democrat - 12 (33.3%)
  • UKIP - 0 (0%)
  • SNP - 0 (0%)
  • Green - 0 (0%)
  • Democratic Unionist - 0 (0%)
  • BNP - 1 (2.8%)
  • Plaid Cymru - 0 (0%)
  • Sinn Fein - 0 (0%)
  • Ulster Unionist - 0 (0%)
  • SDLP - 0 (0%)
  • Other - 0 (0%)
  • I'm undecided. - 0 (0%)
  • I can't vote. - 13 (36.1%)
  • I won't vote. - 5 (13.9%)
  • Total Voters: 36

 Topic: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?

 (Read 65659 times)
  • Previous page 1 ... 6 7 89 10 ... 22 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #210 - April 25, 2010, 01:53 PM
    Quote from: J4m3z
    If government is set up in such a way that it is near impossible to improve our country by following the rules, then revolution is necessary.

    I really don't think things have become that bad.
    You need to read this book.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #211 - April 25, 2010, 02:12 PM
    Quote from: J4m3z on April 23, 2010, 12:12 PM
    The only way to combat the complacency that is turning this country upside down is if we start being brutally honest.

    It is not that PeruvianSkies is unable to change, it's that she is not ready.

    Neither are the British people.

    Or it's because I don't want to discuss things with you cause of your fucking attitude problem.
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #212 - April 25, 2010, 02:30 PM
    Quote from: Godot on April 25, 2010, 01:53 PM
    I really don't think things have become that bad.


    I think they're worse than we can see. And what we can see is pretty bad. For all those governmental scandals that have reached the headlines, how many have been successfully kept secret? I'd say we get taxed quite heavily, yet the nation is in a lot of debt, whilst those who are supposed to be working for the people are enjoying the high life. They even get flashy new workplaces that cost crazy amounts of money.

    Government needs to be more open, more accountable to the people. But the ironic thing is, only the government itself can make this happen. Just as they decide their own salaries, expenses, etc. Government currently governs itself. It needs to be kept in check by an institution that is separate from and equal in power to the government. But we have to trust the government to give us that. Will they give us it? It can be done, yes, but could we ever rationally expect that it will be done?
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #213 - April 25, 2010, 02:31 PM
    Quote from: PeruvianSkies on April 25, 2010, 02:12 PM
    Or it's because I don't want to discuss things with you cause of your fucking attitude problem.


    Stop pretending. You were just as angry before I came onto the scene. You just can't be arsed. Don't worry, I don't blame you. Majority of people in the UK are exactly the same  Afro
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #214 - April 25, 2010, 03:04 PM

    --Emma Goldman
    Each of us a failed state in stark relief against the backdrop of the perfect worlds we seek.
    Propagandhi - Failed States
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #215 - April 25, 2010, 03:13 PM
    The main parties are in long-term decline. This is good because they don't represent the interests of the vast majority of people; voting for them is endorsing the system they run together.

    Sometimes tactical voting is a legitimate tactic, especially if there are serious differences. But they are al promising to make the biggest cuts since Margaret Thatcher; I won't vote in this meaningless popularity contest; I won't vote for my poison.

    We could do with a popular front. More, revolution. But only that will happen when people are prepared for REAL change,
    "...every imperfection in man is a bond with heaven..." - Karl Marx
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #216 - April 25, 2010, 03:15 PM
    Quote from: J4m3z on April 25, 2010, 01:38 PM
    The assessment of whether a revolution or reformation is needed or not is not determined by the quality of life of the citizens in that country. It is determined by the ability for the citizens to change the country for the better. If government is set up in such a way that it is near impossible to improve our country by following the rules, then revolution is necessary.


    This, I'm happy to say, stands at odds with things you've said in the past.

    Real upheaval is necessary. Let's bring it, in our own ways and others.
    "...every imperfection in man is a bond with heaven..." - Karl Marx
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #217 - April 25, 2010, 03:25 PM
    @ thinkfree:

    That's the kind of thing I imagine Godot would deem as getting carried away with ourselves. But really, is it so farfetched? We see it happening on the surface - the Prime Minister calling off a general election because he realizes his unpopularity, calling off referendums and only allowing referendums when they know the people will agree with the government on that occassion. On those occassions, it's obvious. But what makes you think the same kind of manipulative thinking doesn't go on at a more secretive yet more profound level? An example that comes to mind is using the war on drugs in order to scare people into accepting a certain set of policies that will enable government to be even more secretive and therefore launder more money out of the public coffers. Or implanting flase information about weapons of mass destruction and then pretending to discover it and use it as justification for a war.

    I reckon, if the "new" government does pass a law that enables us to recall our MPs at any time, there will be some hidden flaw or loophole that will have been cleverly thought out by politicians and that will enable them to carry on pretty much as normal. When politicians go "yep, okay, let's allow our people to sack us whenever they want," you have to be extremely suspicious lol.
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #218 - April 25, 2010, 03:34 PM
    Quote from: panoptic on April 25, 2010, 03:13 PM
    The main parties are in long-term decline. This is good because they don't represent the interests of the vast majority of people; voting for them is endorsing the system they run together.

    Sometimes tactical voting is a legitimate tactic, especially if there are serious differences. But they are al promising to make the biggest cuts since Margaret Thatcher; I won't vote in this meaningless popularity contest; I won't vote for my poison.

    We could do with a popular front. More, revolution. But only that will happen when people are prepared for REAL change,


    You've got a point, and I was originally going to spoil my ballot paper. After the first PM debate, I thought, why not just give Lib Dem a chance. I'm going to wait and see what this new government will do. I'll be very pissed off if they don't pass the recall law.
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #219 - April 25, 2010, 03:49 PM
    cosmetic changes, though.

    I understand anyone who wants to vote for someone other than the tories. but they're all the same.
    "...every imperfection in man is a bond with heaven..." - Karl Marx
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #220 - April 25, 2010, 04:58 PM
    Quote from: Godot on April 25, 2010, 12:20 PM
    You can't win with these people. You could convince a few, maybe, but most of them had made their minds up about politics many years ago. It's an almost fatalistic attitude of "things suck, nothing will change, nothing can be done, and I won't even try, so don't ask". These people are the toughest sort to persuade when it comes to voting, but we still have to try I guess.

    Why not voting is the thing to do?

    Jose Saramago's novel Seeing tells a story of strange events that took place in an unidentified capital city of an unidentified democratic country.

    The elections are over and the turnout has been really high. But when the results are announced the government is devastated to discover that over 70% of the votes cast are blank. Not spoiled, not abstained, just blank. They hastily call a new election but the results only get worse, now over 83% have cast blank votes. The Government panics, indignantly struggling to contain what they see as a strike at the very heart of democracy. But there is no sign of where this conspiracy has come from, no sign of what criminal mastermind is behind it all.
     
    500 citizens are seized at random and their families informed that they shouldn't worry about the lack of info on whereabouts of their loved ones: "In that very silence lays the key that could guarantee their personal safety". This doesn't work and the government declares a state of emergency and blockades the City and finally manufactures its own terrorist ring leader. But life continues almost normally as people fight back in a Ghandian non-violent way.

    Why is not voting more problematic for any government than voting against it?

    Because any government has only so much power that its subject - we - are willing to give it.

    "The voter’s abstention goes further than the intra-political negation, the vote of no confidence: it rejects the very frame of decision.

    The threat today is not passivity, but pseudo activity, the urge to be active, to participate, to mask the nothingness of what is going on. People intervene all the time, "do something”; academics participate in meaningless debates, and so on.

    The truly difficult thing is to step back, to withdraw. those in power often prefer even a  `critical` participation , a dialogue, to silence - just to engage us in dialogue, to make sure our ominous passivity is broken. The voter’s abstention is thus a true political act: it forcefully confronts us with the vacuity of today's democracies."
    -Slavoj Zizek: Violence
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #221 - April 25, 2010, 05:05 PM
    Should we go to the polling station and hand in our ballot papers blank/spoiled or should we not go to the polling station? Or will it not make a difference?

    I think when they reveal the results they also count how many ballots were cast but where no vote for a particular political party could be ascertained. That would suggest we should go to the polling station and spoil our ballot papers over staying at home, I think...
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #222 - April 25, 2010, 05:13 PM
    Quote from: J4m3z on April 25, 2010, 05:05 PM
    Should we go to the polling station and hand in our ballot papers blank/spoiled or should we not go to the polling station? Or will it not make a difference?

    The difference is crucial. I’ll go to the polling station and cast a blank vote.
    The very participation with a blank vote is the essence of subversion here.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #223 - April 25, 2010, 05:20 PM
    Panoptic, will you do the same?

    A 2nd person has voted Conservative...  mysmilie_977
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #224 - April 25, 2010, 06:22 PM
    Quote from: J4m3z on April 25, 2010, 05:20 PM
    A 2nd person has voted Conservative...  mysmilie_977

    That was me.

    I'm not exactly a through and through Tory or anything, but in this particular election I'll probably vote for them.
    .
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #225 - April 25, 2010, 06:24 PM
    Quote from: Shahid Raza on April 25, 2010, 06:22 PM
    That was me.

    I'm not exactly a through and through Tory or anything, but in this particular election I'll probably vote for them.


    Don't be a traitor, to human life.
    "...every imperfection in man is a bond with heaven..." - Karl Marx
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #226 - April 25, 2010, 06:27 PM
    Quote from: Shahid Raza on April 25, 2010, 06:22 PM
    I'm not exactly a through and through Tory or anything, but in this particular election I'll probably vote for them.

    Why?
    You need to read this book.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #227 - April 25, 2010, 06:30 PM
    Quote from: Godot on April 23, 2010, 12:43 PM
    Things need to change.

    That's the problem. The more things change, the more they stay the same.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #228 - April 25, 2010, 06:55 PM
    Quote from: Kenan on April 25, 2010, 06:30 PM
    That's the problem. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

    Deep.
    You need to read this book.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #229 - April 25, 2010, 07:19 PM
    Quote from: Kenan on April 25, 2010, 06:30 PM
    That's the problem. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CANdGjspGE
    Each of us a failed state in stark relief against the backdrop of the perfect worlds we seek.
    Propagandhi - Failed States
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #230 - April 25, 2010, 08:23 PM
    @ Kenan, what are your general political views, if you don't mind me asking? And why will you be making a protest vote?

    @ Panoptic, I used to think Capitalism was right but now I'm sympathetic to Socialism, if that is the change you're talking about in me. However, we clashed in a thread (I think it was the drugs thread) about Statism. I still think Government is necessary to maintain social order.

    @ Shahid Raza, why will you be voting Conservative at this particular election?
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #231 - April 25, 2010, 10:20 PM
    Quote from: Godot on April 25, 2010, 06:55 PM
    Deep.

    Lol. I see a pattern there.

    Quote from: J4m3z on April 25, 2010, 08:23 PM
    @ Kenan, what are your general political views, if you don't mind me asking? And why will you be making a protest vote?

    My political views are complicated and I don't fit into any particular definition. I see myself as libertarian utopian humanist that would like to live in a society that maximises of everybody's freedom.
    One of the reasons why the current system is deeply flawed is the fact that people with more material power enjoy a greater political power compared to the rest to a point where a large segment
    of the population is effectively nearly excluded from political game and society at large.

    Btw the 20th century interpretation of socialism/communism was nearly a total and complete failure.
    But to quote Samuel Beckett: 'Try again. Fail again. Fail better.'

    I will be making a protest vote because imo that is the optimal thing to do. Paradoxically it's voter's abstention rather than participation that renders itself into a true political act.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #232 - April 25, 2010, 10:25 PM
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krybvOx-8Dk
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #233 - April 25, 2010, 10:28 PM
    Kenan, what kind of libertarian do you consider yourself?
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #234 - April 25, 2010, 10:34 PM
    Quote from: Kenan on April 25, 2010, 10:20 PM
    My political views are complicated and I don't fit into any particular definition. I see myself as libertarian utopian humanist that would like to live in a society that maximises of everybody's freedom.
    One of the reasons why the current system is deeply flawed is the fact that people with more material power enjoy a greater political power compared to the rest to a point where a large segment
    of the population is effectively nearly excluded from political game and society at large.

    Btw the 20th century interpretation of socialism/communism was nearly a total and complete failure.
    But to quote Samuel Beckett: 'Try again. Fail again. Fail better.'

    I will be making a protest vote because imo that is the optimal thing to do. Paradoxically it's voter's abstention rather than participation that renders itself into a true political act.


    Are you socialist? I can't tell from those two bits I've highlighted ^^
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #235 - April 25, 2010, 10:57 PM
    Quote from: Iraqi Atheist on April 25, 2010, 10:28 PM
    Kenan, what kind of libertarian do you consider yourself?

    I don't really like labels because they are constrictive but I would perhaps choose left-libertarianism. I definitely do have issues with the fact that somebody can claim private ownership of natural resources to the detriment of others.

    Quote from: J4m3z on April 25, 2010, 10:34 PM
    Are you socialist? I can't tell from those two bits I've highlighted ^^

    Lots of socialist ideas do appeal to me but there some that do not. And the 20th century interpretation of socialism was utterly authoritarian and essentially anti-socialist.
    The key here is 'Try again. Fail again. Fail better.'
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #236 - April 25, 2010, 11:01 PM
    Generally speaking, I will probably vote Conservatives because:

    They want to boost the private sector for long term economic stability.
    Investing in high speed rail and opposing expansion of Heathrow.
    The proposal to print all expenses and government spending on the web (of the 3 main partys, they've been ahead of the game in terms of dealing with the whole expenses scandal).
    Reducing immigration (it's been way too high under Labour).
    They're pro-family stance (call me a traditionalist).

    Feel free to list reasons to NOT vote Tories.
    .
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #237 - April 25, 2010, 11:16 PM
    Could you elaborate on the pro-family stance? other than giving tax credits to married couples, which other policies of theirs are pro-family?
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #238 - April 25, 2010, 11:26 PM
    I can't elaborate sorry because I'm not very well informed, but ultimately with my limited knowledge of each party I am going to make my own mind up on who I'm going to vote for.  On issues like pro-family, I think attitute can sometimes be more important then actual policy.
    .
  • Re: The 2010 UK election - who will you vote for?
     Reply #239 - April 25, 2010, 11:30 PM
    Fair enough. My question is what do you mean by saying your pro-family?
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