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Theme Changer

 Poll

  • Question: Which one (if any) are you more inclined to side with? (Give reasons)
  • Israel - 50 (30.5%)
  • Palestine - 114 (69.5%)
  • Total Voters: 163

 Topic: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?

 (Read 233256 times)
  • Previous page 1 ... 14 15 1617 18 ... 39 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #450 - September 21, 2011, 03:46 AM

    Fair enough. You have to admit it is an interesting dilemma for them though. On the one hand, they pacify the home front but totally fuck over their foreign policy (most likely permanently). On the other hand, they endure manic screaming on the home front and probably lose the next election over it, but in the long term view of their national interest and in terms of basic morality they'd be streets ahead.

    Now if they are really governing in the national interest this would be a no brainer. At the moment everyone is expecting them to keep doing the conventional dumb thing, but it would be kinda awesome if they didn't.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #451 - September 21, 2011, 03:50 AM

    45% of Americans support recognition of the Palestinian state, while 36% oppose.

    http://www.globescan.com/news_archives/bbc2011_palestine/

    This isn't about public opinion as much as it's about corporate interest, as is usually the case in American politics.
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #452 - September 21, 2011, 04:01 AM

    Yes but regardless of which way they go, it wont really have any adverse effects on corporate interests. So, it comes down to whether think they can get away with it in terms of public opinion within the US.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #453 - September 21, 2011, 04:06 AM

    Of course they can get away with it. No one gives a shit about Palestinian people's rights to a state. Not a single shit will be given when the US inevitably cowtows to Israeli interests and vetoes this resolution.

    No one gives a shit.

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #454 - September 21, 2011, 04:14 AM

    It's kinda complicated os and Abood as

    (a) US corporate interests are not always monolithic.

    (b) Not all corporate interests are equal in terms of their influence over the government in general and our foreign policy in particular.

    (c) Imperialist foreign policy is sometimes about protecting the interests of particular companies, but more often about asserting the dominance of the nation-state and those who rule it (the corporations) in general.

    fuck you
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #455 - September 21, 2011, 04:15 AM

    @asbdsp: No I mean if they don't veto.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #456 - September 21, 2011, 04:17 AM

    It's kinda complicated os and Abood as

    (a) US corporate interests are not always monolithic.

    (b) Not all corporate interests are equal in terms of their influence over the government in general and our foreign policy in particular.

    (c) Imperialist foreign policy is sometimes about protecting the interests of particular companies, but more often about asserting the dominance of the nation-state and those who rule it (the corporations) in general.

    Yeah I understand all of that. Offhand though I can't see how vetoing or not vetoing is going to make much difference to corporate interests in the US.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #457 - September 21, 2011, 04:23 AM

    Political interests, namely lobbies are the ones tying American government's hands on this one Os. At least that's my general perception of the situation.

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #458 - September 21, 2011, 04:37 AM

    I read some time ago on opensecrets.org that for single-issue lobbying organizations, the pro-Israel groups spent more than the pro/anti-firearms and pro/anti-abortion groups combined. I just went to look for the latest info and interestingly enough http://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/alphalist_issue.php, Israel has been removed from the "issues" section of the site. My guess is they were pressured by said groups into doing a Stalinist cleansing of the inconvenient fact that the pro-Israel lobby is ridiculously powerful and spends billions buying off the government and other major social institutions.

    fuck you
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #459 - September 21, 2011, 06:34 AM

    That.  Corporate interests may be interesting but apocalyptic and cosmic narratives are much more emotional and personal for religious nuts of all stripes from the hardcore Christian Zionists to the more moderate in speech but just as extreme " Israel is a beacon of democracy" smoke screen.  The US will cow to Israeli interests because domestic religious groups and the Israeli lobby.  Fuck that shit and fuck the doomsday Christians and Jewish assholes that are leading everything to perdition.

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #460 - September 21, 2011, 11:59 PM

    That.  Corporate interests may be interesting but apocalyptic and cosmic narratives are much more emotional and personal for religious nuts of all stripes from the hardcore Christian Zionists to the more moderate in speech but just as extreme " Israel is a beacon of democracy" smoke screen.  The US will cow to Israeli interests because domestic religious groups and the Israeli lobby.  Fuck that shit and fuck the doomsday Christians and Jewish assholes that are leading everything to perdition.


     Afro
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #461 - September 22, 2011, 12:17 AM

    This article sums it up pretty well: The humiliation of Barack Obama

    Quote
    Sooner or later, it's going to happen. Most likely, the moment will come just before his first head-of-state meeting in New York. Or perhaps it will happen just before his first side-bar meeting with Binyamin Netanyahu. Or then again, it may come as the cumulative reaction to a series of embarrassing encounters with fellow world leaders. But the moment will come.

    At some point this coming week, during his visit to the this year's opening of the United Nations General Assembly in New York, US President Barack Obama is going to have a nearly irresistible urge. He is going to want to stand up to his hovering political handlers and the smothering bureaucracy which tries to dictate his every move, summon his personal dignity, and say "Enough".


    Quote
    We all know what the Americans have been saying: That what President Mahmoud Abbas (Abu Mazen) is doing is counter-productive, that it is a repudiation of the Oslo Accords, that it is an attempt to avoid the necessity of reaching a negotiated solution with the Israelis. We have seen the US policy juggernaut gearing up, as the same arguments are repeated by US envoys to the Palestinians and to the Quartet, elaborated publicly by the secretary of state and by the White House spokesman, and delivered in dozens of other fora, both great and small.

    However, repeating the same thing, loudly and insistently, does not make it so. President Obama knows this very well. He understands the Israeli-Palestinian issue backwards and forwards. He knows the peace process is at a dead end.

    Early in his administration, he tried to revive negotiations by mandating a complete West Bank settlement freeze, only to be forced embarrassingly by Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu to back down. When this past May he had the temerity to publicly tell the Israelis that their current policy towards the Palestinians is untenable and unsustainable, and to modestly suggest a negotiating formula to break the impasse, he was publicly chastised by Netanyahu and had to submit to the humiliation of seeing the Congressional leaders of his own party repudiate him in favour of the Israeli prime minister.

    In response, though he cannot admit it, Obama has washed his hands of the Palestinian issue. He knows he can do nothing more. And yet, the issue will not go away.

    Now, once again, he is being forced to publicly support an Israeli policy position fundamentally opposed to his own. He knows fully well that Netanyahu has no intention of permitting formation of a viable Palestinian state, and that the Palestinians have little choice but to pursue their current course at the UN.

    He likewise understands that the US' lonely support for Israel and the inevitable US veto of the Palestinians' bid for full UN membership will undermine, perhaps terminally, the US position in a democratising Middle East, and will expose the US' nominal support for popular Arab rights as a fraud.


    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #462 - September 22, 2011, 01:00 AM

    Israel's control over my country's foreign policy is fuckin ridiculous. In the Dem debates during Obama's primary campaign, the candidates all pledged loyalty to Israel. I mean, what the fuck? What country are you running for President for? The candidates for the head of the world's most powerful state of 300 million feel obliged to pledge fealty to a country of under 8 million that's smaller than Massachusetts (one of our smaller states)? Is it any wonder people develop conspiracy theories about a Zionist Occupied Government? And dissenters are called anti-Semites and utterly denounced and ostracized from government and other powerful social institutions. It's completely fucking insane.

    fuck you
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #463 - September 22, 2011, 01:04 AM

    Yes it is crazy. I mean I can easily understand what Israel gets out of US patronage. That's easy. What's baffling is WTF does the US (really) get out of blindly supporting Israel no matter how stupid Israel's actions are? It's bloody disastrous for America's foreign policy and national interest.

    Oh and technically, shouldn't presidential candidates pledging loyalty to a foreign state be regarded as something dangerously close to treason?

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #464 - September 22, 2011, 01:11 AM

    Well they don't say it outright. They just say they support Israel, are allies of Israel, friends of Israel, etc, and when questioned on foreign policy or "national security" issues, mention Israel. Sickening really.

    fuck you
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #465 - September 22, 2011, 01:14 AM

    Support of Israel has nothing to do with positively influencing America's national security. If anything, it is markedly detrimental.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #466 - September 22, 2011, 01:18 AM

    Pastor Os, which hymn should we sing next?

    fuck you
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #467 - September 22, 2011, 01:23 AM

    "Jerusalem" seems appropriate. grin12

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #468 - September 22, 2011, 01:46 AM

    Yes it is crazy. I mean I can easily understand what Israel gets out of US patronage. That's easy. What's baffling is WTF does the US (really) get out of blindly supporting Israel no matter how stupid Israel's actions are? It's bloody disastrous for America's foreign policy and national interest.

    Oh and technically, shouldn't presidential candidates pledging loyalty to a foreign state be regarded as something dangerously close to treason?


    I wonder

    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #469 - September 22, 2011, 03:37 AM

    Its principled support of an ideological ally in a troubled region of the world. We cannot abandon these freedom loving peoples simply because its politically "convenient" or might further national security goals. My country is showing incredible backbone on this matter.






     Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #470 - September 22, 2011, 08:51 AM

    Nicolas Sarkozy Versus Barack Obama
     
    zionist Nicolas Sarkozy Mallah  on Palestinian State
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jSg0nscEzA

    Barack Obama, A Racist  Jew on Palestinian State
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxwK9PcpXXg


    No..no.no., we can not get that Palestinian state by talks that too juice and zionist controlling the world..  The only way to get that state is allah way as rasoolallah said 1400 years back.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AvkxP1--Cz8

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #471 - September 22, 2011, 08:59 AM

    I have no idea what you're talking about, but I'm sure it's totally awesome. Smiley

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #472 - September 22, 2011, 09:01 AM

    juice juice every where..

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwabdVvCjGQ

    Israel's control over my country's foreign policy is fuckin ridiculous. I......It's completely fucking insane.

    Enjoy the insane fucking dear Colonel Q-D

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HovvZCYfWEI

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqQsRNa3U-8

    that was may 2011...

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #473 - September 22, 2011, 09:04 AM

    I have no idea what you're talking about, but I'm sure it's totally awesome. Smiley

    Me??  I am talking NOTHING..nothing  osAma ., 

    I am neither pro Isreal nor Pro Palestine but pro Juice.. I want every one to drink juice.. it is good for health..

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #474 - September 22, 2011, 02:39 PM

    Yeezedee - lo was the youtube link of Yasser Arafat citing the Prophet - for my benefit? And again the year was 2003 after the Israeli's has islamicized the Palestinian struggle.

    I am my own worst enemy and best friend, itsa bit of a squeeze in a three-quarter bed, tho. Unhinged!? If I was a dog I would be having kittens, that is unhinged. Footloose n fancy free, forced to fit, fated to fly. One or 2 words, 3 and 3/thirds, looking comely but lonely, till I made them homely.D
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #475 - September 22, 2011, 03:02 PM

    Me??  I am talking NOTHING..nothing  osAma ., 

    I am neither pro Isreal nor Pro Palestine but pro Juice.. I want every one to drink juice.. it is good for health..


     Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy will help you play better chess! rofl rofl



    The World is my country, all mankind are my brethren, and to do good is my religion.
                                   Thomas Paine

    Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored !- Aldous Huxley
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #476 - September 22, 2011, 09:38 PM

    Yeezevee, u say that you ate neither pro Israel or pro Palestinian but pro juice. Comes.across that your more anti-Islam than pro juice.

    I am my own worst enemy and best friend, itsa bit of a squeeze in a three-quarter bed, tho. Unhinged!? If I was a dog I would be having kittens, that is unhinged. Footloose n fancy free, forced to fit, fated to fly. One or 2 words, 3 and 3/thirds, looking comely but lonely, till I made them homely.D
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #477 - September 23, 2011, 08:18 PM

    I fucking hate both, inshallah Syria deserves to own it again, I heard on the Arab news that Syrians are starting to awake and they are beginning to hate more protesters and the existence of Turkey, Allah hu akbar! Israel is bad, and Palestine is also bad.

    I love Gadaffi, especially his wonderful quote which I think goes like ''Let's make israetine'' (it means cancer in arabic)
    Palestine is pig  piggy Israel is pig piggy Palestinians shouldn't leave their country if they really cared about their country, and I don't need to comment about Jews or else I will be sued. Kiss mwah kisses to all of you. Solved. Love, from Qatar.

    Here I write my life about Muslims ruining my life because I am against their bad deeds: http://www.angrymuslimman.tumblr.com/
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #478 - September 23, 2011, 08:28 PM

    An angry muslim who hates muslims wacko


    Welcome to the forum Grin

    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • Re: Pro Israel or Pro Palestine?
     Reply #479 - September 23, 2011, 08:32 PM

    Moreover, an angry Muslim who kisses random people on the internet. You're sending out some mixed messages there, dude...
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