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Theme Changer

 Topic: Hi confused muslim here

 (Read 16343 times)
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  • Hi confused muslim here
     OP - January 12, 2012, 07:14 PM

    Hello there

    Im a muslim who is somewhat confused about islam at the moment. I wanted to get some resources on all of the arguements against islam and then compare them with the arguements for islam and check out the references etc and make an informed decision.

    If your able to provide all of the islamic refutation sites, links, books, all the resources available so I can view every single arguement in detail it would be great. A lot of things dont make sense, the slavery, the beating of women, 4 wives, 9 year old wife, and much more, but its a big step and so i want to thoroughly research before taking the step.

    I need every single arguement so I can feel content with my choice knowing I didnt overlook anything. Dont feel the need to be PC, im only concerned with the references, i dont care about the insults against islam.

    Also, for me, I believe you should devote your life to spreading the truth. So if I keep Islam, I will be devoting my life to spreading it. And if I reject Islam, I feel the world should know its false as this seems a critical time in history right now that Islam could go either way so I'd like to know more about the ex muslim and anti islamic cause so that I can contribute to it and get involved. Are there any ex muslim talks and events I can attend? Are there charities and organisations I can contribute to? Could you provide some information on the anti islamic movement and let me know how its progressing as Id like to know if people are becoming more enlightened in the muslim world as Ive never actually travelled to any muslim countries. Does it look like Islam will fade away or become dominant in the world? Seems like apostacy is becoming more common.

    Im quite interested to hear more about you all, I shall read through your intro's as im interested to know how people end up leaving islam. if anyone fancies sending me some books, im quite poor at the moment and could do with some books to read on the topic. do you have "dawa stalls" like the muslims do or leaflets or free books? I know there are some books on ex muslims but i cant afford it so anyone fancy giving some "saddaqa fisabililllah" lol then let me know. Only well known members of the forum though as i dont fancy giving my private details to anyone else as its somewhat risky as muslims are psychopaths when it comes to apostacy.

    Id like to know all about the movement so please let me know more, im excited to find a whole movement I can be part of as Ive really had doubts about islam for a long time now but not had much chance to talk to anyone about it or relate to anyone.

  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #1 - January 12, 2012, 07:22 PM

    Have you not doomed yourself to hell by asking these questions?

    If the truth will set you free, maybe you have already said goodbye to the ways you are used to.  I don't know how much science you have studied, but where should authority lie, in a book or in the thinking of many many people around the world over centuries?

    I have just posted something that I think is an important starting point

    Quote
    Professor Johannes Thomas of the University of Paderborn[2] pointed out that our sources for the conquest of Spain by Muslims are quite late and unreliable. There are no Arabic inscriptions dating back to the Eighth Century and only six dating back to the Ninth. The earliest description of the conquest of North Africa and Spain written in Arabic was written by Ibn Abd al-Hakam, an Egyptian who had never been in Spain and who is said to have written the text in the middle of the 9th Century. As the Dutch Arabist Rienhard Dozy said this account has no more historical value than the fairy tales in "The Book of the Thousand Nights and One Night". But as Professor Thomas pointed out, al-Hakam is not an exception, all other Arabian reports and compilations give us the same fairy tales.

    Leaning on the methodology established by Albrecht Noth, Thomas tries to sort out what really happened between the Eighth and Eleventh Century in Spain.

    Professor Helmut Waldmann of TŸbingen gave a brief history of Zurvanism -a branch of Zoroastrianism that had the divinity Zurvan as its First Principle (primordial creator deity). In the second part of his talk, Waldmann gave a sketch of the influence of Zurvanism on Islam.

    Filippo Rainieri described the Historic Roots of Sharia, while Geneviève Gobillot of the University of Lyons revealed the astonishing similarities of Koranic theology and the thought of Lactantius [died c.320] an early Christian author, a Latin-speaking native of North Africa, who taught rhetoric in various cities of the Eastern Roman Empire, ending in Constantinople. His Divinae Institutiones ("Divine Institutions"), an early example of a systematic presentation of Christian thought, was probably written between 303 and 311.

    Christoph Heger, convinced of the validity of Christoph Luxenberg and Volker Popp's thesis that early documents, inscriptions and coins that contain the terms "muhammad" and " 'ali" should not be understood as proper names of the putatively historical figures of Islamic historiography but as honorific titles of Jesus Christ, argued that confirmation of the said thesis could be found in the old text of an inscription of a talisman in the possession of Tewfik Canaan.[3] The text of the talisman should be read as:

    "O healer, O God! Help from God and near victory and good tiding of the believers! O praised one [muhammad], O merciful one, O benefactor. There is no young man like the high one [ 'ali] and no sword like the two-edged sword of the high one. O God, O living one, O eternal one, O Lord of majesty and honour, O merciful one, O compassionate one".

    This text should be understood as an invocation of Jesus Christ- the healer, the good tiding, the praised, merciful and high one, the young hero, "out of the mouth [of whom] went a sharp two-edged sword" [Apoc. 1:16], namely “the word of God,” which is “sharper than any two-edged sword” [Hebrews 4:12].

    Where Dr. Markus Gross discussed the Buddhist influence on Islam, Professor Kropp explained the Ethiopian elements in the Koran. Independent scholar, traveller, and numismatist Volker Popp argued that Islamic history as recounted by Islamic historians has a Biblical structure –the first four caliphs are clearly modelled on Adam, Noah, Abraham, and Moses. The Muslim historians transformed historical facts to fit a Biblical pattern. Popp also developed a fascinating thesis that Islamic historians had a propensity to turn nomen (gentile) (name of the gens or clan) into patronyms; a patronym being a component of a personal name based on the name of one's father. Thus Islamic historians had a tendency to take, for instance, Iranian names on inscriptions and turn them into Arabic-sounding names. Having turned Iranians into Arabs, the next step was to turn historical events connected with the original Iranians which had nothing to do with Islamic history into Islamic history. For example, Islamic history knows various so called Civil Wars. One of them was between Abd-al-Malik, his governor al-Hajjaj and the rival caliph in Mecca by the name of Abdallah Zubair. The evidence of inscriptions tells us that the name Zubayr is a misreading. The correct reading is ZNBYL. This was made into ZUBYL by the Arab historians. From ZUBYL they derived the name Zubair, which has no Semitic root. The real story is a fight between Abd al-Malik at Merv and the King of Kabulistan, who held the title ZNBYL. This took place between 60 and 75 Arab era in the East of the former Sassanian domains. The historians transferred this feud to Mecca and Jerusalem and then embedded the whole into the structure of a well known story from the Old Testament, the secession of Omri and his building the Temple of Samaria.

    The paper delivered by Rainer Nabielek of Berlin provided evidence of a successful application of Luxenberg’s method not only to the Koran but to non-religious texts as well. This was convincingly shown by means of a hitherto unsolved medical term. This medical term can be traced back to Syriac in the same way as many Koranic expressions as demonstrated by Luxenberg. In addition to this Nabielek pointed in his paper to the hitherto overlooked phenomenon of the existence of loan syntax in classical Arabic. His contribution confirms the validity of Luxenberg’s method in general.

    Keith Small compared the textual variants in the New Testament manuscripts and Koranic manuscripts. Dr. Elisabeth Puin gave a lucid, and highly original analysis of an early Koran manuscript from Sana, Yemen, [DAM 01-27.1] in part written over a palimpsest Koranic text. Dr. Elisabeth Puin summarized her findings and their implications,

    “As for the scriptio superior, the comparison with the Standard text [Cairo 1924/25 Koran] shows that it still contains many differences in orthography and verse counting; there are even minor textual variants, like, for example, singular instead of plural, wa- instead of fa-, and so on. Some - but by far not all - of those differences were at a later stage corrected by erasure and /or amendments. We cannot suppose that all the differences are only due to the calligrapher's inattention, being simply spelling mistakes; there are too many of them on every page, and some of them are found repeatedly, not only in this manuscript but in others too. So we must conclude that at the stage when and in the region where the manuscript was written those variants were not felt to be mistakes but conformed to a specific writing tradition.”    

    Professor Van Reeth, already much impressed by Luxenberg's thesis and methodology, gave two talks at the conference. The shorter one compared the image of the pearl in four passages in the Koran that refer to a eucharistic prayer, and a parallel image found in the Eucharist of the Manichaeans. The longer talk discussed the similarities of the Islamic vision of the union of Muhammad with his God, and the commentary of Ephrem the Syrian on the union of the believer with God.

    Ibn Warraq gave a brief account of the errors, fallacies, and contradictions in Edward Said's highly influential Orientalism. Dr. Dšhla focused on Spain, and described the historical settings in which the two groups of Mozarabs (8th c. to 12th c.) and Moriscos (16th c.) had been living. These two groups used the Arabic script to write their Romance and Spanish texts. “This contact of two different systems offers the opportunity to find out more about the phonetic realisations of Vulgar-Arabic and the Romance language transcribed.”[4]

    Dr Reynolds of the University of Notre Dame (U.S.A.) examined the meaning of the difficult term hanif, found in the Koran but clearly a non-Arabic word. It probably comes from the Syriac word hanpa, meaning pagan, but in the Koran it has a secondary Syriac meaning, of a clan (gens); ethnicity. In the Koran the term is almost always used in connection with Abraham, but in the sense of his ethnicity and never his religion.

    Finally, Christoph Luxenberg himself gave an impressive talk that seemed to untie some difficult knots that several centuries of both Islamic and Western scholarship had been unable to undo. He gave an original explanation of the so-called mysterious letters with which some Surahs commence. At the beginning of twenty nine suras following the bismillah stands a letter, or a group of letters which are simply read as separate letters of the alphabet.[5] Luxenberg suggested that they all had something to do with Syriac liturgical traditions. For instance, the letter êŒd at the beginning of Surah 38 indicates the number 90, referring to Psalm 90, while the letters A L R to be found at the beginning of Surahs 10, 11, 12, 14, 15 are a Syriac abbreviation meaning “The Lord said to me.”


    http://www.newenglishreview.org/custpage.cfm/frm/19589/sec_id/19589

    btw I am not a muslim.

    (and welcome!)

    When you are a Bear of Very Little Brain, and you Think of Things, you find sometimes that a Thing which seemed very Thingish inside you is quite different when it gets out into the open and has other people looking at it.


    A.A. Milne,

    "We cannot slaughter each other out of the human impasse"
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #2 - January 12, 2012, 07:23 PM

    Welcome!

    I like your approach.

    Have you heard the good news? There is no God!
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #3 - January 12, 2012, 07:27 PM

    moi, I would be doomed to hell if I didnt repent after becoming certain Islam is the truth.

    Whatever the truth is, if there is a god out there, im sure he wants us to search for the truth, and if he doesnt exist then i want to be sure he doesnt exist so I can enjoy my few years on the earth before i perish and rot in the ground.

    As Islam is my starting point, i need to be sure its false before moving on and so would like to full research the area. If Islam is a false religion, its a very dangerous one and needs to be stopped. the only way that I would not feel obliged to seriously oppose islam is if it was the true religion in which case it needs to be supported obviously. so this is a key life changing thing for me and i really need resources
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #4 - January 12, 2012, 07:29 PM

    Huh! .. what is this all about??
    Hello there

    Im a muslim who is somewhat confused about islam at the moment. I wanted to get some resources on all of the arguements against islam............

    Why??

    Quote
    If your able to provide all of the islamic refutation sites, links, books, all teh resources available so I can view every single arguement in detail it would be great. A lot of things dont make sense, the slavery, the beating of women, 4 wives, 9 year old wife, and much more, but its a big step and so i want to thoroughly research before taking the step.

     what?? and you were a Muslim?? No that didn't happen.,   No 9 year old wife., it is all cock and bull story jon..

    Quote
    I need every single arguement ...
     i dont care about the insults against islam.

    Huh! what??
     That is too much ., you need every single argument against Islam?? Why?
     why do you need them??  
    why you don't care people insulting Islam??
    what is the color of your under wear?
    Quote
    Also, for me, I believe you should devote your life to spreading the truth.

    No.. Nope.,  we don't believe that, we believe in eating, sleeping and confusing people.. and having fun with life..

    Quote
    So if I keep Islam, I will be devoting my life to spreading it. And if I reject Islam, I feel the world should know its false as this seems a critical time in history right now

    Good do the first thing forget the rest jon..


    Quote
    that Islam could go either way so I'd like to know more about the ex muslim and anti islamic cause so that I can contribute to it and get involved. Are there any ex muslim talks and events I can attend? Are there charities and organisations I can contribute to?

     well you can send me a check . I want to buy a ABC..

    Quote
    .... Seems like apostacy (APOSTASY) is becoming more common.

    talk too much about that we let authorities know about you.... where do you come from .. tell us about your country .. place you live, bank account .. what do you drive and how much you make ??

    Quote
    ... I dont fancy giving my private details to anyone else as its somewhat risky as muslims are psychopaths when it comes to apostacy.
    ....

    Huh! who said that to you?? you sound like a Psycho man...   lol..

    welcome to CEMB jon.....Jondoe ..

    with best wishes
    yeezevee

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #5 - January 12, 2012, 07:34 PM

    yeezevee im sorry but i didnt understand your post.

    i want this thread to become a resource where i can get access to all anti musilm and islam refutation sites in one place, so that i can start my research and decide my path in life.

    are you a muslim? if so, im happy to discuss with you in anotehr thread but this thread is for a comprehensive resource as opposed to pages and pages of discussion so please discuss with me in a different thread.

    Thanks. Jon (p.s. my names not actually jon but seeing as muslim converts always incist on changing there name to muslim ones then I will be chaning my name to a "kafir" name if I leave Islam Lol and plus its safer if I dont give me name away)

    p.s. we can discuss the issue of ayesha's age in another thread if you like if you dont believe she was 9. im happy to look at the proofs you have but this thread is for anti muslim sites only so i have a list of resources. discussions can happen in another thread
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #6 - January 12, 2012, 07:35 PM

    I'll save you all the hassle.

    Islam is simply the biggest, baddest, sickest, and dumbest "truth" of all time.

    But it's good that you're doing your research and actually discovering other avenues than Islam.
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #7 - January 12, 2012, 07:36 PM

    Oh, and whatever you do, don't go on Ummah.com to try and discover the "truth".
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #8 - January 12, 2012, 07:36 PM

    not as simple as that demba. im a person who likes to be academic and research, not just make a decision because someone told me to. this wont be resolve with three line posts containing no proofs or references, I want to look into all the issues in detail and make a seriously informed choice. You havent saved me any hassle
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #9 - January 12, 2012, 07:42 PM

    that appears to be an islamic website. obviously i will be going to islamic sources also to see what their side of the story is. No offence but your behaving not much differently to religious clergy by telling me not to research or hear the other side. can we make this simple and simply provide me with some references. i presumed you all would be of a high intellectual level as you have left islam for a more enlightened religion, so I presume you will have some proofs and arguements against islam. I have come accross many on my google travels, but i need a comprehensive set of resources so i can sit down and research.

    no offence but im a little bit dismayed at the level on intellectual posts so far, im expecting better than this. Are you not the most enlightened and brightest of the "ummah" to have realised islam is a false religion and that the truth is atheism and science?

    I hope this makes sense. Atheists are usually portrayed as intelligent and enlightened compared to religious zealouts so im expecting high level of acadamia from this forum. i presume you all have studied at universities and things and so are aware of the academic method used in referencing and discussing topics of an academic nature. Anyone who doesnt follow this method and cannot hold an intellectual discussion, please refrain from posting. thanks





  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #10 - January 12, 2012, 07:42 PM

    Fair enough, I wasn't being serious anyway.

    When I left Islam, I was going through a period of nearly 2 years reading and soul searching. The last 6 months, especially, were very intense.... I couldn't switch my brain off.

    Carry on doing your research.... make sure you know what Muhammed thought about the shape of the earth! lol Grin
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #11 - January 12, 2012, 07:43 PM

    im sure some of you have some websites for me to start reading?
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #12 - January 12, 2012, 07:44 PM

    oh ok sorry demba, sounds good, prehaps you can provide some anti islamic websites with articles on this issue that you mentioned so I can read more?
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #13 - January 12, 2012, 07:45 PM

    that appears to be an islamic website. obviously i will be going to islamic sources also to see what their side of the story is. No offence but your behaving not much differently to religious clergy by telling me not to research or hear the other side. can we make this simple and simply provide me with some references. i presumed you all would be of a high intellectual level as you have left islam for a more enlightened religion, so I presume you will have some proofs and arguements against islam. I have come accross many on my google travels, but i need a comprehensive set of resources so i can sit down and research.

    no offence but im a little bit dismayed at the level on intellectual posts so far, im expecting better than this. Are you not the most enlightened and brightest of the "ummah" to have realised islam is a false religion and that the truth is atheism and science?

    I hope this makes sense. Atheists are usually portrayed as intelligent and enlightened compared to religious zealouts so im expecting high level of acadamia from this forum. i presume you all have studied at universities and things and so are aware of the academic method used in referencing and discussing topics of an academic nature. Anyone who doesnt follow this method and cannot hold an intellectual discussion, please refrain from posting. thanks








    No need to get your knickers in a twist, sheesh! You have to realise that many of us here are bored and fed-up of all of this religion v atheism debates.

    I don't know why anyone should be doing the hard work for you by providing you with references. You do it.
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #14 - January 12, 2012, 07:46 PM

    A good place to start would be to watch some of the videos uploaded by CEMB on youtube.
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #15 - January 12, 2012, 07:46 PM

    sorry if i have been rude and blunt, I wish to get straight to the point as being in a state of limbo and not knowing what I believe is not a nice state to be in because I dont know where im going in life or what my aims are so I just want to get to the bottom of the issues and it will take a long time and now the thread is quickly filling up without having any of the resources i needed, i needed something concise so i can always access it and read through some good websites and articles
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #16 - January 12, 2012, 07:48 PM

    demba, im not asking you to reference hadeeth and qur'an, im asking for links to websites where the work has already been done. You cant expect the average muslim to pick up the qur'an and hadeeth and come to the conclusion that islam is false, there are over 1,000,000 hadeeth, most of them mundane and containing little that would arouse suspicion. this is probabily how islam survived so long.
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #17 - January 12, 2012, 07:50 PM

    can you provide a link to the youtube account? please post links. You tell me i need to do the work, what are you doing on an ex muslim website if your aim is not to help enlighten muslims? You should be a bit more eager to post the links up and make it easy for people to access. if your not concerned with bringing muslims to atheism, whats the point in an organisation called the ex muslim council of britain?
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #18 - January 12, 2012, 07:51 PM

    yeezevee im sorry but i didnt understand your post.

     Don't worry about that jon_C.. no one understand what i write...

    Quote
    i want this thread to become a resource where i can get access to all anti musilm and islam refutation sites in one place, so that i can start my research and decide my path in life.

     My goodness you really have BIG GOALS IN LIFE.. why you are choosing such difficult path jon_C??   Don't you want to have friends/girls friends/wife/wives/kid.. family etc..etc...?
    Quote
    are you a muslim?

    Nope I am Zebra....

    Quote
    if so, im happy to discuss with you in anotehr thread but this thread is for a comprehensive resource as opposed to pages and pages of discussion so please discuss with me in a different thread.

    Oh! OK jon... ., by the way there is a folder as resource center in CEMB
     
    Quote
    p.s. we can discuss the issue of ayesha's age in another thread if you like if you dont believe she was 9. im happy to look at the proofs you have but this thread is for anti muslim sites only so i have a list of resources. discussions can happen in another thread

    That is good., I will be glad to learn that from you., I certainly don't believe Aisha was 9 year old., In fact there was NO AISHA in Islam during the time Prophet .. Aisha came after death of Prophet....  

    with best regards
    yeezeveee

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #19 - January 12, 2012, 07:54 PM

    can you provide a link to the youtube account? please post links. You tell me i need to do the work, what are you doing on an ex muslim website if your aim is not to help enlighten muslims? You should be a bit more eager to post the links up and make it easy for people to access. if your not concerned with bringing muslims to atheism, whats the point in an organisation called the ex muslim council of britain?

    Boy you really excited Jon.. Here is Huge website with plenty of anti Islamic info

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #20 - January 12, 2012, 07:59 PM

    thanks yeezevee, really helpful. Your annoying me. please leave the thread

    and no i dont want friends/girlfriends/wife/wives/family/children at the moment, i want to understand why im here before i die and its too late to firgue it out. also teh world is a messed up place and i wish to contribute something to the world but currently i have several very different options and need to get to the bottom of some issues including religious ones.

    Once i figure this out, then i will relax and get married/have orgies/sleep with prostitues or whatever my new chosen path dictates is the best way forward
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #21 - January 12, 2012, 08:01 PM

    can you provide a link to the youtube account? please post links. You tell me i need to do the work, what are you doing on an ex muslim website if your aim is not to help enlighten muslims? You should be a bit more eager to post the links up and make it easy for people to access. if your not concerned with bringing muslims to atheism, whats the point in an organisation called the ex muslim council of britain?


    If you go to places such as http://www.faithfreedom.org/ , you will find plenty of resources refuting Islam from a scientific, moral, historical etc points of view.

    Here's the link for the youtube videos - http://www.youtube.com/user/CEMBadmins?feature=g-all-c

    It doesn't take much of an effort to find these resources (I'm sure others will post better ones anyway), so don't justify your laziness on what your wrote above.

    Anyway, enjoy! (finding out the truth... finally!) Grin
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #22 - January 12, 2012, 08:04 PM

    thanks yeezevee, really helpful. Your annoying me. please leave the thread

     Cheesy I know I am sorry jon_c., trust me  this is my last post in this folder ..lol
    Quote
    and no i dont want friends/girlfriends/wife/wives/family/children at the moment, i want to understand why im here before i die and its too late to firgue it out. also teh world is a messed up place and i wish to contribute something to the world but currently i have several very different options and need to get to the bottom of some issues including religious ones.

    Once i figure this out, then i will relax and get married/have orgies/sleep with prostitues or whatever my new chosen path dictates is the best way forward

    Jon..jon..jon.. 

    may I suggest you one thing?? ..Cool  down..please.... don't burn out..

    there is loooooooooooong way to go., 

    with best wishes
    yeezevee

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #23 - January 12, 2012, 08:07 PM

    BTW, you certainly don't need to be clever or intelligent to refute religions.

    You simply need to think without fear, with an open mind, and with rationale and logic.

  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #24 - January 12, 2012, 08:09 PM

    can you provide a link to the youtube account? please post links. You tell me i need to do the work, what are you doing on an ex muslim website if your aim is not to help enlighten muslims? You should be a bit more eager to post the links up and make it easy for people to access. if your not concerned with bringing muslims to atheism, whats the point in an organisation called the ex muslim council of britain?


    Confrontational.......interesting.

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #25 - January 12, 2012, 08:36 PM

    why is it interesting berbs? I expected a different set of posts. Not blank links that didnt go anywhere. Im not a friendly person. just someone who wishes to get to the truth. dont expect lots of social posts from me, im not looking for friends or a community to belong to, Im doing well in my university studies and believe I can make a contribution to the world and need to figure things out and believe this is a good resource to help me arive at the truth. Simple as. What do you expect? If you expect me to be all warm and fuzzy simply because your apostates from islam then your no different to religions, just looking for a place to belong.

    If any of you know anything about the world, it is heading for some major catastrophes and needs people with solutions and i intend to contribute to that and need to know, for example, whether to commit to aiding the muslim cause, or the western democracy cause, or the communist cause, or the hippy cause etc. In order to strike Islam off my list I wish to research.

    I dont like how you all have turned apostating from islam into a social thing, it seems non of you know the severity of the situation. If you are correct and Islam is falsehood, we have 1.5bn fanatics who may possibly be posed to take the world over. and its taken me all evening to get a few links
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #26 - January 12, 2012, 08:38 PM

    You are no doubting muslim.

    I smell troll all over your posts.

    You think I care about your desire to socialise?  hardly.  You're just someone on the internet, you can be as miserable and unfriendly as you want.

    No, its the troll vibe you are giving off.

    You are not genuine.


    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #27 - January 12, 2012, 08:40 PM



    I dont like how you all have turned apostating from islam into a social thing, it seems non of you know the severity of the situation. If you are correct and Islam is falsehood, we have 1.5bn fanatics who may possibly be posed to take the world over. and its taken me all evening to get a few links


    A doubting muslims would never say this. Would never face some decision over whether to go to war against islam.  Cheesy


    Secondly you can't be doing that great at uni if you needed hours to get a few links.  Your research skills fail.


    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #28 - January 12, 2012, 08:40 PM

    BTW, you certainly don't need to be clever or intelligent to refute religions.

    You simply need to think without fear, with an open mind, and with rationale and logic.




    i disagree. ive had some discussions with some moron atheists before and they were only atheists because they thought scientists were atheist and atheists are clever therefore atheism must be true in a nutshell. Thats why i dont wish to discuss with morons who dont even know why they follow what they follow, and instead wish to discuss and learnf rom those who are able to give detailed refutations. Islamic websites can churn out pages of proofs and would run rings round the average atheist.

    thats why for me, i need to read teh likes of richard dawkins rather than listening to village idiots who are just following the religion of the day which is currently atheism

  • Re: Hi confused muslim here
     Reply #29 - January 12, 2012, 08:41 PM

    jon-confused

    Stop getting obnoxious about the whole thing. If we want a place for ex-muslims to hang out, debate, etc, then we will have it. Nothing wrong with that.

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