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 Topic: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians

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  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #90 - October 15, 2011, 06:36 PM
    Quote from: Jinn and Tonic on October 14, 2011, 02:18 PM
    Thanks, Lynna... also, I would like your thoughts on the post I asked
    about hermaphrodites and those with ambiguous genitalia.  What do
    they do? are they gay or not?  Are they free to marry either male or
    female in the church?

    These questions are both easier and harder to answer.
    There are differing genetic make up for these idividuals as well as different degree in body appearence variation from range of normal. So each person pretty much would need to be consider individually.
    An absolute thing the person would have to do is detrmine how they wanted the birth defect repaired before they came to a point in their life that they wanted to get married. Or at least determine what sex they wanted to live as and find a spouse will to live with that situation. Changing back and forth between sexes would not be honest or kind. This of course is just for those who genetically and physically it is impossible to tell if they are male or female. Some might want to remain single instead of making a choice.
    If the individual was more male or more female genetically and/or physically then they'd have to go with that fact.  Sex change operations are considered wrong. If a person had a sex change operation then had sex with some one the same sex they were before the change that would be considered a homosexual relationship.
    If a person absolutely felt diferenty they might a want to remain single.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #91 - October 16, 2011, 04:51 AM
    Gets a bit more complicated when you stop looking at old books and start looking around. Cheesy
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #92 - October 16, 2011, 01:58 PM
    Last night I started to reply to this twice. Once I deleted the reply, when half done, by accident. The second time things just went bad, my little dog was licking my face and I was trying to get off line to phone so could call some one, Then it is morning and I'm looking at a blank screen. Oh well, such is life. I have some time now.
    Quote from: Jinn and Tonic on October 15, 2011, 09:37 PM
    But what about the ones who are, say, more female, but
    are a male "soul"?

    In the case you suggest you have aready stated the person is MORE FEMALE. So the problem is a female with the birth defect of having some male features AND having the emotional problem of feeling like she should be male. Feeling like you are something you are not is not cause to justify whatever feeling you have.
    Quote from:  Jinn and Tonic
    Why would they choose to remain single?

    A person might choose to remain single if there is no clear resolution to their problem because a wrong choice could put them in the position of displeasing God. In this case the possibility of a homosexual relationship, which is clearly not allowed. (see 1 Corinthians 6:9-11). There are many people who choose
     singleness and other who have it chosen for them by circumstances. In either case it's a matter of faith to live such a life. (see Hebrews 11:1-40)
    Quote from:  Jinn and Tonic
    Because genetics and/or GOD mutated their genes?

    God did not mutate them or their genes. God does not try us with evil things. (see James 1:13-15).
    Quote from:  Jinn and Tonic
    One person in 2,000 have ambiguous
    genitalia.

    1 in 2,000 people have ambiguous genitalia (unable to tell what it is) OR 1 in 2,000 have genitalia outside the range of normal. There is a big difference in those two statement. I think it is the second one that's true but I cant cut and paste or open more then one screen at a time. Anyhow I'm a nurse  and I've seen alot of genitalia and taken alot of of medical histories in the last 23 years and in my experience the second statement is true.

    Out of time for this morning.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #93 - October 16, 2011, 08:04 PM
    Wow! Please read carefully.
    God does not try with evil. I'm sitting in my nephew's resturant without even a Bible iin my hand so I can only tell you what I remember, In the case of Job read the book carefully it is clearly Satan that causes ever sort of bad thing to happen to Job.
    In the case of birth defects or accident that happen now days it is clearly unforeseen circumstances. These can a rise from all kinds of sorces.  There is absolutelly no evidence that God causes birth defects or accidents.

    Quote from: Jinn and Tonic on October 16, 2011, 03:10 PM
    So WHO/WHAT created evil?  If god didnt, who or what did?
    I thought god was the only one who could create ANYTHING
    So if god didnt create them, who/what did?

      
    There are a lot of ideas in this shot gun blast of questions. However I think for the topic at hand the main point is: God is the only one that can create life or something from nothing  (obviously a more detailed scientific statement can be made) however living things can reproduce without God assistance. Evil came about because of the misuse of freewill.
    Quote from:  Jinn and Tonic
    so god allowed them to have
    screwed up bodies

    Yes during this period of time God allows bad things to happen.  Perhaps a topic for another tme.
    Quote from:  Jinn and Tonic
    so they would be deprived of the most basic of human needs?  Love, acceptance, and the opportunity to have a family?  

    Are people with disabilities deprived of most basic human needs because of their departer from the norm or because of society's lack of ability to see the person.

    Part 2 to follow
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #94 - October 16, 2011, 09:30 PM
    Part 2
    From where did the following committs come?
    What indeed are your motives? Is it really logically and insghtful conversaional about anothers believes?
    This I do doubt because there is no doubt you have attempted to credit to me what I never said.
    Please do look back at what I've said and tell me exactly what brought about the following quote.

    Quote from: Jinn and Tonic on October 16, 2011, 03:10 PM

    You think they are all evil?  you think people with ambiguous genitalia are
    evil? or their condition is evil?  And then, no rectifacation for this evil?  Other
    than remaining celibate for their entire lives.  I bet that makes them feel really good about themselves that god ALLOWED evil to make them who
    they are.  Must really do their mental health and spirituality a world of good!

    I answered your first question  about how people in my religion would handle the  situation by saying:
    Quote from: Lynna on October 15, 2011, 06:36 PM
    These questions are both easier and harder to answer.
    There are differing genetic make up for these idividuals as well as different degree in body appearence variation from range of normal. So each person pretty much would need to be consider individually.
    An absolute thing the person would have to do is detrmine how they wanted the birth defect repaired before they came to a point in their life that they wanted to get married. Or at least determine what sex they wanted to live as and find a spouse will to live with that situation. Changing back and forth between sexes would not be honest or kind. This of course is just for those who genetically and physically it is impossible to tell if they are male or female. Some might want to remain single instead of making a choice.
    If the individual was more male or more female genetically and/or physically then they'd have to go with that fact.  Sex change operations are considered wrong. If a person had a sex change operation then had sex with some one the same sex they were before the change that would be considered a homosexual relationship.
    If a person absolutely felt diferenty they might a want to remain single.


    What part of that caused your above statements about evil?

    Please do point it out?
     
    Part3 to follow
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #95 - October 17, 2011, 02:25 AM
    Part 3
    Once again look at your claim then tell me on what bases you put words in my mouth.

    Quote from: Jinn and Tonic on October 16, 2011, 03:10 PM
    not
    limited to hermaphrodites, but also the physically handicap, mental retardation,
    and a host of other coditions.

    You think they are all evil?  you think people with ambiguous genitalia are
    evil? or their condition is evil?  And then, no rectifacation for this evil?  Other
    than remaining celibate for their entire lives.  I bet that makes them feel
    really good about themselves that god ALLOWED evil to make them who
    they are.  Must really do their mental health and spirituality a world of good! 

    My reply to your questions about how people of religion would deal with hermaphrodites.
     
    Quote from: Lynna on March 07, 1974, 08:35 AM
    In the case you suggest you have aready stated the person is MORE FEMALE. So the problem is a female with the birth defect of having some male features AND having the emotional problem of feeling like she should be male. Feeling like you are something you are not is not cause to justify whatever feeling you have.A person might choose to remain single if there is no clear resolution to their problem because a wrong choice could put them in the position of displeasing God. In this case the possibility of a homosexual relationship, which is clearly not allowed. (see 1 Corinthians 6:9-11). There are many people who choose
     singleness and other who have it chosen for them by circumstances. In either case it's a matter of faith to live such a life. (see Hebrews 11:1-40)God did not mutate them or their genes. God does not try us with evil things. (see James 1:13-15). 1 in 2,000 people have ambiguous genitalia (unable to tell what it is) OR 1 in 2,000 have genitalia outside the range of normal. There is a big difference in those two statement. I think it is the second one that's true but I cant cut and paste or open more then one screen at a time. Anyhow I'm a nurse  and I've seen alot of genitalia and taken alot of of medical histories in the last 23 years and in my experience the second statement is true


    If you can't handle the fact that other people think and feel differently then you then many suggest  you don't ask questions.

    Your own opinion, feelings and thoughts on the matter seem poorly formed  and aimed only at harassing me.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #96 - October 17, 2011, 06:35 PM
    Quote from: Lynna on October 14, 2011, 01:11 PM
    Not every one who is an Ex-muslim does the same thing here. Not ever one who was associated with Islam are the "same degree of Ex-muslim". Some actually were believer, while others had the religion inflicted on them by family and community. There are even Ex-muslims who don't come here. So the fact your a name says Ex-muslim under it does not totally explain what you are doing here. Ex-muslim would really only be the opening words.

    There are tons of online forums. People tend to join them based on some personal interest with them for socialization.
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  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #97 - October 17, 2011, 07:25 PM
    Oh my gosh, an honest answer.
    And...
    What is this...
    Yes, some added words below your name.
    Drama King?!?!
    I would have never guessed!!
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #98 - October 17, 2011, 07:31 PM
    Quote from: Lynna on October 16, 2011, 08:04 PM
     There is absolutelly no evidence that God causes birth defects or accidents.




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  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #99 - October 18, 2011, 12:53 PM
     Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
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  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #100 - October 24, 2011, 02:40 AM
    Quote from: muddy on January 20, 2011, 08:37 PM
    Thanks guys! But remember, he is my boss. I would only choose to ask light questions.

     

    Religion and politics are too things i would recommend you never discuss in the workplace. Better safe than sorry  Afro
    In my opinion a life without curiosity is not a life worth living
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #101 - October 24, 2011, 03:25 AM
    Quote from: crazyislam on October 17, 2011, 07:31 PM
    (Clicky for piccy!)

    Cheesy

    Well hey, Lynna does have a point. After all, there is absolutely no evidence that God causes anything at all.
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #102 - October 24, 2011, 05:42 AM
    Quote from: osmanthus on October 24, 2011, 03:25 AM
    Cheesy

    Well hey, Lynna does have a point. After all, there is absolutely no evidence that God causes anything at all.


    Oh my gosh! I've been misquoted again. If did this to one of you even half as openly I'd be jumped from ten directons or have to extend a thousand (well at least one)  written apologies and someone would end up with it as their signature. 

    What I said was "There is absolutely no proof that God causes birth defects and accidents,"

    Totally amazes me how easily some who claims to say there is no god will attribute ill deeds to a god but fail to ever what to think a god could do good.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #103 - October 24, 2011, 06:04 AM
    No, you haven't been misquoted at all. I know what you said.
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #104 - October 24, 2011, 06:12 AM
    Okay you know what I said.
    But when you said it back you said "didn't caused anything"
    Anyhow I'm likely just being pissy because I don't feel good.
    That's why I'm awake in the wee hours o the morning.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #105 - October 24, 2011, 01:01 PM
    Lynna, you have hijacked my thread pretty badly. Meanwhile, 6000 years old universe or rapture stuff are enough to make fun of Christians.
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  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #106 - October 24, 2011, 02:02 PM
    Good things come from God, bad things come from satan.. Problem solved..  Cheesy
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  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #107 - October 24, 2011, 02:19 PM
    Quote from: muddy on October 24, 2011, 02:02 PM
    Good things come from God, bad things come from satan.. Problem solved..  Cheesy

    No somethings just happen. God does not micromanage creation.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #108 - October 24, 2011, 02:23 PM
    Quote from: Kenan on October 24, 2011, 01:48 PM
    Meaning that god is not in charge.

    But I thought that he is the alpha and the omega, that nothing happens without his approval?


    What made you think that?
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #109 - October 24, 2011, 02:29 PM
    You stated that "There is absolutely no proof that God causes birth defects and accidents." meaning that god does not control everything and that not everything is mandated by god.

    Hence he is not 100% in charge.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #110 - October 24, 2011, 02:36 PM
    So your point is....
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #111 - October 24, 2011, 03:17 PM
    Quote from: muddy on October 24, 2011, 01:01 PM
    Lynna, you have hijacked my thread pretty badly. Meanwhile, 6000 years old universe or rapture stuff are enough to make fun of Christians.

    To Muddy
    Sorry that your thread got hijacked,, however it may not have been me that did it. I think it was the people that asked me the other questions.
    If I had known it was bothering you I would have asked for the thread to be splint or I would have answered the questions by saying they were off topic for this thread.
    I do not believe in rapture or 6,000 year old universe. Both these things can be disproved with the Bible.
    As regard to these things being laughable perhaps if you thought of them as happening in a vacuum they would be. Since however what a person wants to believe is a matter of free will it is usually better to be more resoectful.  That respect would be the first  step to insightful and meaningful conversation.
     
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #112 - October 24, 2011, 03:37 PM
    Quote from: Kenan on October 24, 2011, 02:41 PM
    Sucks to be The Absolute One yet not be fully in charge?

    Sounds like faulty goods to me. Is there a warranty period?


    Okay. I think I get what you're about.
    This is a long subject for the time I have available, also we are on Muddy's thread.
    I was going to try to give brief answer but there is not one, other then what I've said.
    I will however get back to you on this if you are actually interested in the answer.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #113 - October 24, 2011, 04:24 PM
    God creates evil indeed, and damns people to suffering deceit.

    For:

    Amos 3:3 Can two walk together, except they be agreed?
    3:4 Will a lion roar in the forest, when he hath no prey? will a young lion cry out of his den, if he have taken nothing?   
    3:5 Can a bird fall in a snare upon the earth, where no gin is for him? shall one take up a snare from the earth, and have taken nothing at all?   
    3:6 Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it?

    and

    Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

    God also lies in order to inflict suffering on others:

    1 KINGS 22:18 And the king of Israel said unto Jehoshaphat, Did I not tell thee that he would prophesy no good concerning me, but evil? 22:19 And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left. 22:20 And the LORD said, Who shall persuade Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramothgilead? And one said on this manner, and another said on that manner. 22:21 And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him. 22:22 And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so. 22:23 Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil concerning thee.

    and

    2 Thessalonians 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 2:12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
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  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #114 - October 24, 2011, 04:37 PM
    Quote from: Lynna on October 24, 2011, 03:37 PM
    I will however get back to you on this if you are actually interested in the answer.

    Yes please.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #115 - October 24, 2011, 07:46 PM
    Quote from: Lynna on October 24, 2011, 03:17 PM
    To Muddy
    Sorry that your thread got hijacked,, however it may not have been me that did it. I think it was the people that asked me the other questions.
    If I had known it was bothering you I would have asked for the thread to be splint or I would have answered the questions by saying they were off topic for this thread.
    I do not believe in rapture or 6,000 year old universe. Both these things can be disproved with the Bible.
    As regard to these things being laughable perhaps if you thought of them as happening in a vacuum they would be. Since however what a person wants to believe is a matter of free will it is usually better to be more resoectful.  That respect would be the first  step to insightful and meaningful conversation.
     

    You don't even know you hijacked the thread. lol
    This thread was about compiling a list of awkward questions to ask moderate christians, but you somehow imagined I am asking you questions and it your duty to make up stuff using round and round arguments, trying to avoid all the conflicts and make up the rest of the stuff on the fly.
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  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #116 - October 24, 2011, 09:51 PM
    Quote from: muddy on October 24, 2011, 07:46 PM
    You don't even know you hijacked the thread. lol
    This thread was about compiling a list of awkward questions to ask moderate christians, but you somehow imagined I am asking you questions and it your duty to make up stuff using round and round arguments, trying to avoid all the conflicts and make up the rest of the stuff on the fly.

    Actually, no.
    I didn't think any of the questions were directed at me, unless they said quote or @ Lynna at the top.  Nor did I think I had any 'duty' to do anything.  Nor did think I HAD TO BE EXCLUDED because I'm a Christian becase it's not suppose to be prejudice here.
    If you will please point out what conflict it is I'm avoiding with round and round arguements and making stuff up on the fly. Because I have been more will over the years here to say "oh.  okay I didn't know that. thanks" Then the other way around not because you all are so smart but because I am unwilling damn others for what they think.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #117 - October 24, 2011, 09:58 PM
    Uh...

    If it helps, Lynna, I think the Book of Ecclesiastes is brilliant.
    قل للمليحة في الخمار الأسود
    مـاذا فـعــلت بــناسـك مـتـعـبد

    قـد كـان شـمّر لــلـصلاة ثـيابه
    حتى خـطرت له بباب المسجد

    ردي عليـه صـلاتـه وصيـامــه
    لا تـقــتـلــيه بـحـق ديــن محمد
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #118 - October 24, 2011, 10:31 PM
    Quote from: strangestdude on October 24, 2011, 08:22 PM
    Deist?

    You can't believe that God is omnibenevolent, omniscient and omnipotent and yet chooses to let people suffer things like rape, child molestation and murder.

    You can't believe that God is omnibenevolent and omniscient, because how can God choose to create Satan knowing fully what would occur? That isn't consistent with omnibenevolence. 



    No not a Deist. I'm actually a real Christian.
    Muddy seem to think I've hijacked this thread and sobverted it's purpose. So if you will start a new thread with these questions I'll do my best.

    All those omni- words are something I want to work on for my own understanding because they are not something my religion uses to discribe  God. They're not all accurate.

    Just something to think about as regards the conditions on earth and Satan: Humans and angels were created with freedom to choose their own course of action and therefore be held responsible for the out come.

    The Deuteronomy 28:15-68 is symbolic language, that is aways slows going. However if there is an actual interest I could make an attempt.  Cut and paste sort of stuff from references.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Discussion about topic: Awkward questions to ask Christians
     Reply #119 - October 25, 2011, 05:13 PM
    Quote from: Lynna on October 24, 2011, 09:51 PM
    If you will please point out what conflict it is I'm avoiding with round and round arguements and making stuff up on the fly. Because I have been more will over the years here to say "oh.  okay I didn't know that. thanks" Then the other way around not because you all are so smart but because I am unwilling damn others for what they think.

    Examples are:
    Quote from: Lynna on October 24, 2011, 03:17 PM
    I do not believe in rapture or 6,000 year old universe. Both these things can be disproved with the Bible.

    Yes, 6000 year old universe is Christianity belief, you are just denying it now because you now know it doesn't make sense anymore. But many other Christians do not deny it.
    Quote from: Lynna on October 16, 2011, 08:04 PM
    There is absolutelly no evidence that God causes birth defects or accidents.

    Very idiotic and stupid statement may I say.. Either you believe in God, or you don't believe in God. If you believe in god, he makes everyone. And causes birth defects, if not, and if he only created Adam and Eve and let the rest go on its own, then there is absolutely no point in praising him day and night.. he just doesn't matter..
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