Have you had ruqyah?

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Have you had ruqyah?
OP - August 17, 2013, 01:50 PM

Hey, I'm not sure if this has already been discussed, I couldn't find a thread so apologies for the repetition.

I know that a lot of ex-Muslims probably get told that their disbelief is related to ayn, black magic or jinn possession, so some of you guys have probably been referred to get ruqyah.

I was just wondering if anyone went through with it, and what happened.

I know most of you are going to say you don't believe in fairies, jinns, gods or anything supernatural, but a lot of you at some point believed in these supernatural things, so I thought maybe some people can share their experiences if they did, or their families assumption that they did in attempts to save themselves.

Like I know a lot of current Muslims who think they are affected and some of them faint or go all weird in the ruqyah session, do you think they are acting? Mental? Or the psychological effect of their belief?

Because there is a belief that those who are effected will try to refrain from going etc, I have agreed to go see what the raqee has to say about me, to prove a point since I have been saying no for a while.

(For those that haven't read my intro, I'm a bit of an inbetweener, not sure if I believe or if I disbelieve at the moment, don't judge me and my semi fairy world )

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Reply #1 - August 17, 2013, 02:09 PM

Does raqee mean watcher or am I thinking something else? It's not like going to see a Priest and being checked for possession is it? If it is, don't do it. Never once have I seen a movie or read a book where this happens and it has a happy ending. Never.

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #2 - August 17, 2013, 02:29 PM

In all seriousness I would think long and hard about this if I were you. I had to look up raqee and found it's just an Islamic word for a very old and wide spread custom. I had a look and it's exactly the same as what other religions do, from christians to hindus to whatever. And yes it's all psychological. Faith is an incredibly powerful thing that can and does effect how we see the world and even how we react ourselves. For instance people who have jinns/demons/devils in them have been cured, and it's the same process you described from what I looked up. And it doesn't work forever because it doesn't solve anything. People who are possessed and thus homosexual are "cured" for a time until they can no longer deny themselves. Others are schizophrenic and are "cured" for a time until the schizophrenia again takes over. It's called the placebo effect.

Catholics who go to confession talk about actually experiencing the holy spirit lifting their burden, forgiving them. Is it actually the holy spirit, or is it the psychological release of confessing an immense guilt you've kept secret and felt ashamed of for however long, unloading and having Father Makey say "You're forgiven, your sin is wiped clean?" This is something that has been researched and tested, the information is there you want to look it up.

You never responded to my last PM so I don't know if you got it, but I said that you.can listen to both sides of the argument, for and against, or you can take some time for yourself and come to your own conclusion.

These are things that have been researched and tested dozens if not hundreds of times. The information is out there and I invite you to look into it. If you actually believe in jinns and possession then this can very easily be exploited while you're in a vulnerable state. This is why I said you should come to your own conclusion. If you allow yourself to be influenced and you again have doubts, it'll be very damaging. Leave islam or stay with it, but it HAS to be your choice. You're the one who needs to see if you can believe it as you should, and by that I mean with none of the heart breaking things you talked about in your intro.

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #3 - August 17, 2013, 02:41 PM

A ruqyaa purports that the problem is with you, inside of you. Don't subject yourself to that. The problem is entirely with the religion of Islam.
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Reply #4 - August 17, 2013, 02:43 PM

You'd agree with my reply?

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #5 - August 17, 2013, 02:44 PM

Isn't it bidda?

Us ex-hanafites never really concerned ourselves with the laughably irrational — notwithstanding the fact that we acknowledged the existence of the laughably irrational.
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Reply #6 - August 17, 2013, 02:53 PM

@QSE I replied to your PM, to be honest its one of the things I found hard to believe even when I was whole heartedly Muslim but people were fainting and shit, it just freaked me out so it made me think its either real or they have mental issues.

@HappyMurtad I'm kind of just doing it to prove a point that there is nothing wrong with me, so that people address my questions. I don't believe I will pass out or that some random voice will come out of me, so if this dude was to say yea there's something wrong with you, I would be able to say he had no proof.

@Schizo probably the part of needing someone to recite over you, because I think it was more of a thing that you did to yourself at the time of the Prophet. And I said no judging my semi-fairy world, with your laughingyness!

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Reply #7 - August 17, 2013, 02:58 PM

Like for example I've questioned the whole, "why don't people in the west (not including the religious) don't seem to get effected by this stuff?" question and I get the whole horror movie possession stuff being based on true stories and how most people believe in magic etc etc.

Or when they give examples of peoples situations that I can't explain.

"Make anyone believe their own knowledge and logic is insufficient and you'll have a puppet susceptible to manipulation."
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Reply #8 - August 17, 2013, 02:59 PM

PMed you back, this really is nothing new. Every demon possession is like this. I've mostly seen the footage and research into christian and voodoo exorcism crap, it's just the EXACT same thing, EXACT same teachings, EXACT same fainting/talking gibberish/whatever else you can thing of. And yes, be it Allah or Krishna or Bondye they're always saved/cured by the god they believe in, if at all. It's purely psychological and it's been extensively researched.

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #9 - August 17, 2013, 03:02 PM

My mum went to a catholic school and there was a boy there who swore blind he was visited by the Blessed Mother. Now either the virgin Mary really did come to him or it was in his head. Likewise people have had the same experience with Shiva. Now either Shiva is also real and really appears to people or it's in their head.

As for why most people in the West don't get this, it's because most people in the West don't believe it. If you don't believe it, you aren't susceptible to it.

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #10 - August 17, 2013, 03:04 PM

For example my Dad is the most anti-religion guy out there, and he used to disbelieve in all supernatural stuff making my Mum go see a psychiatrist when she claimed to see her dead Dad in her house.

But he believes in supernatural stuff now because he lived in a house where the front door used to open and shut by its self and you could see a blur of something and hear footsteps going up the steps whenever it did it.

I know seeing is believing and I sound like a right moose right now with my gobble di goop.

I do have some rationality I promise, just wondering what people think the explanation is. Not necessarily from a religious perspective.

I can imagine people chat shit being a prominent answer lol

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Reply #11 - August 17, 2013, 03:05 PM

Quote from: Quod Sum Eris on August 17, 2013, 03:02 PM
As for why most people in the West don't get this, it's because most people in the West don't believe it. If you don't believe it, you aren't susceptible to it.

I asked that question, would you be able to send me something related to the studies on the effects of belief on supernatural experiences please

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Reply #12 - August 17, 2013, 03:15 PM

Been a few years since I looked into it but I'll see if I have anything saved. You can also google it. Anyone got anything while I go through my files and saves?

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #13 - August 17, 2013, 03:18 PM

So although I don't really believe it will do anything you think its a bad idea??

@QSE I've watched some Christian exorcism stuff that can be rather extreme, but the Islamic version isn't really like that, they just recite parts of the Qur'an over you. Believe me if a group of people were whacking me and swinging me about I wouldn't volunteer myself

I'll try googling

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Reply #14 - August 17, 2013, 03:22 PM

That's just the most violent fucked up shit. Most of it is words like with islam. And believe me, some islamic also get physical. Anyone remember the name of that bloke in Yemen who drowned a four year old to "save" him? Held him under while he thrashed to get free, drowned.

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #15 - August 17, 2013, 03:30 PM

WTF! It makes me angry when I here of this shit happening to kids.

I was watching a documentary about witchcraft exorcisms in the congo, it was the most disturbing thing to watch, it was always little kids that are apparently effected and its just child abuse. I don't understand how anyone as part of the filming did not kick the shit out of those people for what they were doing and could just sit and watch babies being abused. Its actually disgusting. It was called "Branded a Witch" it was a BBC three documentary, can't seem to find the youtube link for the full documentary but its quite disturbing to watch.

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Reply #16 - August 17, 2013, 03:40 PM

Couldn't find anything saved, I guess it's all on my old computer. Find anything good on google?

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #17 - August 17, 2013, 03:45 PM

Just stuff about "The Exorcist" the film and Christian exorcism stuff, nothing relating to the psychology as of yet

And links to mental health

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Reply #18 - August 17, 2013, 03:54 PM

I found this quite interesting.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evil-deeds/200804/dangerous-states-mind

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #19 - August 17, 2013, 03:56 PM

Would you agree exorcism is about mental health? Are your current doubts supernatural influence or purely a product of your own mind? Do we doubt because we doubt or because some outside force makes us doubt?

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #20 - August 17, 2013, 04:03 PM

Quote
Ruqya Support is here to provide you guidance, advice and emotional support during your difficult affliction with sihr (witchcraft / black magic / Jinn possession).

http://www.ruqyasupport.com/ruqya-support/

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Reply #21 - August 17, 2013, 04:06 PM

Remind me of Derren Brown: miracles for sale. That actually showed perfectly the power of suggestion. In fact, going from memory I'd recommend it.

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #22 - August 17, 2013, 04:08 PM

I used to believe in all of that stuff but lately I stopped and realised it was all bollocks.My family on the other hand are nuts,they believe in ALL of it,for example my mom uses this stinky incense to " purify " us and chase away the ayn and bad spirits every 2 weeks.There's actually a funny story about my dad,back in the day when he was around 10 people thought he was possesed by a jinn (for some silly reason) and took him to a priest who did ruqyah,but apparently it didn't work so those freaks decided they should kill him because the jinn will never go away,but after hearing that my dad escaped and now he's alive and well,no sign of any jinn.
There's also this time at a funeral where they did ruqyah and everyone was going crazy and I was just like : wtf is going on ? worst day of my life.
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Reply #23 - August 17, 2013, 04:11 PM

Just seen the link from billy. About 1:20 he says black magic, evil, is real but harms no one except by Allah's permission. Does he realise the contradiction with the rest of what he said?

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #24 - August 17, 2013, 04:25 PM

I cracked up at this: http://www.ruqyasupport.com/how-to-recognise-a-magician-video/

Where do you find them?

My first girlfriend.
Stonehenge at summer and winter.
Pagan sites on the internet.
Hogwarts.
Children's birthday party.
Friend of mine.
The theatre.
Jibb's before she converted to islam.
People Jibb's knows/knew.

Any else?

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #25 - August 17, 2013, 04:30 PM

Quote from: Quod Sum Eris on August 17, 2013, 03:56 PM
Would you agree exorcism is about mental health? Are your current doubts supernatural influence or purely a product of your own mind? Do we doubt because we doubt or because some outside force makes us doubt?

I believe that in most circumstances if people are acting crazy its cos theirs crazy, and should seek psychological help. I don't think my doubts are related to anything supernatural, although it does make me wonder why something may have made sense to me at some point and not now, but I wouldn't think I'm behaving strangely so I'm not mentally ill or so I'd like to think lol.

@ billy recommendations ?

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Reply #26 - August 17, 2013, 04:32 PM

The last two places to find them weren't taking the piss out of you just to be clear, I'm remembering you used to be a Wiccan.

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #27 - August 17, 2013, 04:34 PM

From my last link:

8.) He sometimes instructs the patient to not touch water for a certain period of time, usually forty days. This indicates the this particular jinn working for the sahir is Christian.

Not sure how to comment on that...

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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Reply #28 - August 17, 2013, 04:39 PM

Who used to be a wiccan?

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Reply #29 - August 17, 2013, 04:41 PM

Me? I think you've mistaken me with someone else...I was agnostic and prior to that Catholic, well I was baptized :/

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