Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran

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- Speedbird
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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
OP - February 28, 2016, 06:13 PM

I will be debunking the story of Adam and Eve using the Quran itself by highlighting the inconsistencies and contradictions the Quran has. The Islamic understanding of the story of Adam and his wife is that they had children and their children then married each other and that is how humanity began. Two people with the same mother and father have sex with each other to reproduce. If that isn't incest then I don't know what else is. Today, society frowns upon incest. It is considered to be one of the most disgusting things one can do, to have sex with your own sibling.

Here are some verses where Allah makes incest haram/forbidden.

"Prohibited to you are your mothers, your daughters, your sisters, your father's sisters, your mother's sisters, your brother's daughters, your sister's daughters, your [milk] mothers who nursed you, your sisters through nursing, your wives' mothers, and your step-daughters under your guardianship [born] of your wives unto whom you have gone in. But if you have not gone in unto them, there is no sin upon you. And [also prohibited are] the wives of your sons who are from your [own] loins, and that you take [in marriage] two sisters simultaneously, except for what has already occurred. Indeed, Allah is ever Forgiving and Merciful"(4:23)

And here are some verses where Allah claims that his laws never change.

"That was the Way of Allah in the case of those who passed away of old, and you will not find any change in the Way of Allah"(33:62)
"This has been consistently the case with all the messengers that we sent before you, and you will find that our system never changes"(17:77)

According to the Quran, there are verses which explicitly forbid any sexual relationship with a blood relative. We are also told that the "way of Allah and his laws never change". If this is true, why on earth do Muslims believe that humanity spread through incest? Why did Allah need incest to kick-start the human race but ban it later down the road? Would that not contradict 33:62 and17:77?

How exactly did we become 7 billion+ people from just one man and his partner without incest? Muslims cannot seem to make their mind up. There is concrete evidence for evolution but not a shred of evidence that humanity began with Adam,Eve and their children engaging in incest.

When a Muslim claims that the Quran does not contain contradictions, know that they are lying. Allah makes incest forbidden in verse 4:23 but also claims that his laws never change in verses 33:62 and 17:77. Allah also claims that he created humanity from Adam and his wife. This means their children had to engage in incest. So later down the road, in the 7th century, Allah had to contradict himself in the Quran. No Muslim can beat around the bush with this contradiction. I presented this finding to a Muslim I know and he was speechless. He walked off saying "you're full of shit man!"A contradiction in the Quran that is impossible to dismiss as a "misunderstanding" and "you have a sealed heart so you cannot understand" as they usually say when evading contradictions.

Islam is a religion of peace..the kind of peace you find six feet under if you try to leave
- Jedi
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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #1 - February 28, 2016, 07:37 PM

Evolution.

No free mixing of the sexes is permitted on these forums or via PM or the various chat groups that are operating.

Women must write modestly and all men must lower their case.

http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?425649-Have-some-Hayaa-%28modesty-shame%29-people!
- three
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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #2 - February 28, 2016, 09:04 PM

You know, I am not certain the Quranic story excludes any other types of people. The Bible, however, makes it very clear that there were other people available for marriage. It says repeatedly in Genesis that the Sons of God married the Daughters of Man, as if they were two communities who intermarried.

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- bogart
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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #3 - February 29, 2016, 02:51 AM

Not true Three. There are lot of interpretations but not one allows for addition humans without linage to Adam. The only case is Lilith but that is the Talmud.

http://biblehub.com/commentaries/genesis/6-2.htm
- puzzlelover
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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #4 - February 29, 2016, 03:29 PM

Quote
First let’s start with how they translated Genesis 6:1-4 in the Torah:

“When men began to increase on earth and daughters were born to them, the divine beings saw how beautiful the daughters of men were and took wives from among those that pleased them. The Lord said, my breath shall not abide in man forever, since he too is flesh; let the days allowed him be one hundred and twenty years. It was then, and later too, that the Nephilim appeared on earth, when the divine beings cohabited with the daughters of men, who bore them offspring. They were the heroes of old, the men of renown.” – Genesis 6:1-4 (Etz Hayim: Torah and Comentary)

http://ministerfortson.com/nephilimarchive/who-are-the-sons-of-god-evidence-from-judaism/

To me it sounds a lot like the gods of Greek mythology coveting and bedding human women and heroes like hercules etc.
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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #5 - February 29, 2016, 03:42 PM

On the point of incest in those times, I believe the official church position is that it was a matter of necessity and not unlawful till Moses brought down the law from Sinai.

Its all a fable anyway, I wasn't as a Roman Catholic taught it as literal truth....and that was a long long time ago.

(I was and am still taken aback by the beliefs of Evangelicals in the U.S.)
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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #6 - March 01, 2016, 01:16 AM

Quote from: bogart on February 29, 2016, 02:51 AM
Not true Three. There are lot of interpretations but not one allows for addition humans without linage to Adam. The only case is Lilith but that is the Talmud.

http://biblehub.com/commentaries/genesis/6-2.htm

How about that. So when they listed Cain and Abel and Cain had a wife in exile, she was just an unlisted daughter of Adam and Eve who went with him or went before him? And Cain was building a city because of himself and his wife and son? It seemed so straightforward.

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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #7 - March 01, 2016, 01:25 AM

Some view Cain's wife as his sister Awan which he had married before his exile from secondary sources depending on what one considers canon. She is like a bad plot device injected unintentionally by the very reference to Cain's sons. This is of course if you take Genesis literally. It one of the hardest case to argue as metaphor becomes mixed with what people consider history. The balance between changes from group to group.
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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #8 - March 01, 2016, 01:28 AM

Ah, yes. I forgot there were other sources.. damn Nicaea.

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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #9 - March 01, 2016, 04:30 AM

Not just that but people make assumption based on references to Cain and Nod. People assume Cain knew his wife in Nod as having met her rather than "knew" as in sexual and family sense. Genesis has major issues hence why a lot of people treat it as metaphor.
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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #10 - March 02, 2016, 01:04 AM

I had just assumed he met her there because no mention was made of her before, in the passage I read it seemed like a timeline. I thought if they had been exiled together she would have had some sort of mention, as so many others immediately after had their marriages listed.

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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #11 - March 02, 2016, 01:56 AM

Assumption fill in the mistakes made in religious texts. Hence the old dogma of a historical view of this particular text survived for so long. Deny obvious mistakes and make up excuses.
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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #12 - March 06, 2016, 12:12 AM

Maybe the references of his wife´s origin and their marriage were deliberately omitted.Perhaps not a mistake..

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- bogart
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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #13 - March 06, 2016, 08:16 PM

Assumption. See?
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Debunking Adam and Eve in the Quran
Reply #14 - March 07, 2016, 04:55 AM

Evolution is true, if anyone disagrees, go to a natural history museum, you will see there is a continuum of all species even variations of the same species to fit their environment, the ones that did not fit their environment died (Natural selection). All animals evolved, one the of the biggest proofs is that we all use DNA and RNA, life does not need this but instead God if he exists decides to make all life work under the same blue print. Not only that, you can take a part of DNA from a fly and put it on a mouse and the mouse will grow a part limb of the fly (look up HOX genes). Humans had a common ancestor with chimps, there was never a first human, all life is on a long continuum, there are no deffinitive transitions from one species to another species, everything is an intermediate. The concept of species does not exist, it is just a way of us TRYING to compartmentalize the biological world and we know this because the rule of what makes up a species is not constant, many animals break the rules we think define species. So all life transitions extremely slowly, each mom gives birth to the same species as herself but after thousands of years you can BEGIN to see the difference and then you can say ok it seems like this is splitting as a separate species, you can not see on a generation-generation basis because evolution works on a geologic time (Huge amounts of time, thousands of years is nothing at this scale, we do not live anywhere close to long enough). The evidence is there, I have summarized this way too short because there are entire university classes to devoted to this, my degree specializes in evolution, If you do not believe, pick any of the topics I listed and do your own research with an open mind.

And by the way our ENTIRE understanding of viruses, bacteria and the way we make our medicine assumes evolution is true, if evolution is not true then we have been searching in the dark and somehow been making very accurate medicines.

There was no first human, evolution happened, no first human = Adam and Eve are not possible and even if the were their kids inbreeding would have a very limited gene pool leading to SEVERE birth defects seen in the third generation of humans and we should have gone extinct thousands of years ago. Adam and Eve being bullshit = Quran is Wrong, and God says if we find a single error in the Quran then its credibility falls apart (here you go adam and bull shit... Quran debunked)

As a scientist I can see farther than any human before me by standing on the shoulders of giants (previous scientists); As a religious follower I can not see what is right in-front of me, even when others INDEPENDENTLY see the same thing!
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