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 Topic: The future of Islam

 (Read 20031 times)
  • 12 3 4 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • The future of Islam
     OP - March 04, 2009, 11:48 AM

    I have been wondering, what do you think the future has in store for islam? What will happen to islam eventually? will it be reformed? Personally, i think that in the future, islam will be a religion specifically for the misfits much like at how nazism has degrade to what it is today, i.e. for children of the misfits. The reason of why i came out with that conclusion is because that as the internet became widespread, more and more people became aware of the vile nature of islam through websites like this one and as people became more aware, eventually they had to make a decision, i.e. either to accept Allah as the one true god or reject him. The decent ones will be the one that had the trouble to accept him and they will, finally, reject him. The one that are able to accept allah as a god, as i see it, will be the misfits, i.e. people like criminals and gangsters.

    For the question as to why the normal decent people will eventually reject allah as a one true god is because for the surahs like the ones that potray allah abusing his power by doing the devil's work (02:07, 02:10, 06:25 and 06:125) and consenting sex with captive outside marriage (23:5-6) . I think that reformation is impossible as muslims will change at least some of the surahs in the quran. So what do you all think?   
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #1 - March 04, 2009, 12:03 PM

    There will be a divide amongst the conservatives, the moderates and the liberals. I hope the numbers of conservatives are reduced but that will only happen if Shariah law is no longer used which I cant really see happening. All we can hope for is for apostasy being made legal and the taboo nature wiped out. This will encourage apostates to come and encourage people to question Islam. Hopefully the number of non-muslims will increase in muslim countries enough so that Shariah law is no longer applicable.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #2 - March 04, 2009, 12:04 PM

    Quote from: Micheal Muhammad Knight, "Taqwacores"

        I stood watching from the screen, draped in the ihram of pilgrims: two white towels, the izar the rida. The izar was wrapped around my waist, the rida over my left shoulder leaving the right shoulder and arm naked. That was how they did it in the time of Prophet Muhammad, peace and blessings be upon him. My bare feet were cold on the spaceship floor. Labbayk Allahumma, Labbayk.

        Over the ihram goes a bulky spacesuit required for survival in Earth's poisonous atmosphere. As I pulled it on I wondered what it might have been like to visit the Holy City when it actually existed--when there was a Kaaba, ZamZam well, stations of Abraham and Shaytans to pelt with stones; back before Mecca and Tokyo and New York and Paris were all identically matching holes in the dirt. The Holy City is now as it was the day baby Ismail cried of thirst and his mother ran desperately between those two hills.

        Goodnight, Islam. Don't let the bed bugs bite.

    -Abu Afak, Ten Million Miles Home


    I chose to get circumcised at 17, don't tell me I never believed.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #3 - March 04, 2009, 12:13 PM

    Wow awais, I like that, that was very well written.  I could almost feel what he felt as he pondered on it.  Afro

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #4 - March 04, 2009, 12:26 PM

    www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13733782/

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #5 - March 04, 2009, 12:32 PM



    My brother just got out from a short sentence, one of the first things he told me about (because he knew I would know about it) was the pressure from the muslims and the imam in there for him to join in.

    He said he travelled hom with one guy on the train, and the guy had his big sack (that they give you on your release) full of his clothes with him, and was reading aloud from the quran, and that an old couple hugged each other in fear and farewell they were so afraid of him.  Cheesy

    He said alot of the muslims youth in there got heavily involved. Plus you get extras if you belong to the group.  He said if it hadn;t been for me and what I had spent so long telling him, he maight have got involved too.

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #6 - March 04, 2009, 12:42 PM

    I suspect that Islam will reform and become more enlightened.

    There will always be those who will be fundamentalists though - but they will be a tiny loony fringe like the Christian fundamentalists - they will be marginalised.

    Unless the nature of human beings changes radically and they take a giant evolutionary step forward, then I suspect they will always need religion to comfort them and the two biggest (Christianity & Islam) are too deeply attached to the hearts of too many people to disappear.

    Maybe in the next millenium lol

     grin12
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #7 - March 04, 2009, 12:46 PM

    I suspect that Islam will reform and become more enlightened.

    There will always be those who will be fundamentalists though - but they will be a tiny loony fringe like the Christian fundamentalists - they will be marginalised.

    Unless the nature of human beings changes radically and they take a giant evolutionary step forward, then I suspect they will always need religion to comfort them and the two biggest (Christianity & Islam) are too deeply attached to the hearts of too many people to disappear.

    Maybe in the next millenium lol

     grin12


    This is using the progress of man so far and what we believe we will progress to in the future, but if something were to happen to set humanity back, a global catastrophe, a break down to governments world wide etc, then you can be sure Islam will regain an even bigger footing.

    People embrace religion even more in times of poverty and despair.

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #8 - March 04, 2009, 12:48 PM



    My brother just got out from a short sentence, one of the first things he told me about (because he knew I would know about it) was the pressure from the muslims and the imam in there for him to join in.

    He said he travelled hom with one guy on the train, and the guy had his big sack (that they give you on your release) full of his clothes with him, and was reading aloud from the quran, and that an old couple hugged each other in fear and farewell they were so afraid of him.  Cheesy

    He said alot of the muslims youth in there got heavily involved. Plus you get extras if you belong to the group.  He said if it hadn;t been for me and what I had spent so long telling him, he maight have got involved too.


    They should vet the Imams they let into prisons.

    btw Hi Berbs good to see you <hugs>
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #9 - March 04, 2009, 12:49 PM

    Personally, i think that in the future, islam will be a religion specifically for the misfits much like at how nazism has degrade to what it is today, i.e. for children of the misfits. The reason of why i came out with that conclusion is because that as the internet became widespread, more and more people became aware of the vile nature of islam through websites like this one and as people became more aware, eventually they had to make a decision, i.e. either to accept Allah as the one true god or reject him. The one that are able to accept allah as a god, as i see it, will be the misfits, i.e. people like criminals and gangsters.

    For the question as to why the normal decent people will eventually reject allah as a one true god is because for the surahs like the ones that potray allah abusing his power by doing the devil's work (02:07, 02:10, 06:25 and 06:125) and consenting sex with captive outside marriage (23:5-6) . I think that reformation is impossible as muslims will change at least some of the surahs in the quran. So what do you all think?    

    Well, li Islam does grow in Europe's jails unfortunately...quite a few new recruits seem to come from there-so it seems to have a following amongst gangsters & misfits currently too. Cheesy As to Islam's future, difficult to say. There are loads of horrific verses in the Quran, and as you've pointed out, till some time back, Muslims weren't aware of these, Mullahs wouldn't speak of the bad bits, today due to the Internet they can have access to these.During the next century, more & more people will have access to the net.  However, Imams can explain these away by some stupid excuses & apologetics, which they do.

    For me personally, Islam is as good or as bad as other faiths... with one fundamental difference. Islam is founded by a single Prophet- just like Christianity by Jesus & Buddhism by the Buddha. Christ & the Buddha were basically decent people, Muhammad was somewhat Wink Mo seems to have committed every crime anyone possibly could in one lifetime.

    Its essential to believe in Muhammad to be a Muslim. The azaan which resonates five times daily from mosques state Allah is the only God followed by the assertion that Muhammad is the Prophet of God. Believing Muhammad is the insaan i kamil or the ideal man is fundamental to being a Muslim.

    It'd be very difficult for many devout Muslims to somehow justify or rationalize all the negative stuff Muhammad did once they become aware of all that he did, if they're also good human beings. Some or the other of his actions are bound to strike them as unacceptable today, & then plenty of them are  on their way to apostasy. great

    They'll have to make a choice, a choice many Christians make on reading the Bible-whether to walk away from a faith which contains such barbarities or to somehow justify these stuff & still believe in the faith, but the choice is made doubly difficult for Muslims as Christians don't have to justify truckloads of evil Jesus did. They can simply keep Christ's teachings & ignore the OT. Muslims will have nothing of their faith left if they began ignoring Muhammad.

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #10 - March 04, 2009, 12:50 PM

    I suspect that Islam will reform and become more enlightened.

    There will always be those who will be fundamentalists though - but they will be a tiny loony fringe like the Christian fundamentalists - they will be marginalised.

    Unless the nature of human beings changes radically and they take a giant evolutionary step forward, then I suspect they will always need religion to comfort them and the two biggest (Christianity & Islam) are too deeply attached to the hearts of too many people to disappear.

    Maybe in the next millenium lol

     grin12


    This is using the progress of man so far and what we believe we will progress to in the future, but if something were to happen to set humanity back, a global catastrophe, a break down to governments world wide etc, then you can be sure Islam will regain an even bigger footing.

    People embrace religion even more in times of poverty and despair.


    Yes, that is a worry.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #11 - March 04, 2009, 12:52 PM



    They should vet the Imams they let into prisons.


    Agreed, it's a shame to think that they would let missionary style imams in to preach to people in a vunerable siatuation.

    Quote
    btw Hi Berbs good to see you <hugs>


    You too hass, I was wondering where you were when I got back. hugs

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #12 - March 04, 2009, 01:06 PM

    I suspect that Islam will reform and become more enlightened.

    There will always be those who will be fundamentalists though - but they will be a tiny loony fringe like the Christian fundamentalists - they will be marginalised.

    Maybe in the next millenium lol

     grin12


    Insh'Allah

    Frankly, I think that within our lifetimes Islam will continue to become more and more radicalized.  I personally see an Islamic Renaissance occurring long after we are all dead and buried, or cremated, or whatever.  wacko

    Atheism is a non-prophet organization.

    The sleeper has awakened -  Dune

    Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day Give him a religion, and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish!
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #13 - March 04, 2009, 01:15 PM

    I suspect that Islam will reform and become more enlightened.

    There will always be those who will be fundamentalists though - but they will be a tiny loony fringe like the Christian fundamentalists - they will be marginalised.

    Maybe in the next millenium lol

     grin12


    Insh'Allah

    Frankly, I think that within our lifetimes Islam will continue to become more and more radicalized.  I personally see an Islamic Renaissance occurring long after we are all dead and buried, or cremated, or whatever.  wacko


    Yes, I think I agree Nur, though I think it will be a sort of last desperate stand of a dying breed.

    But it will be in the short term - in fact we may have already seen the high point of it.

    Although attacks like Mumbai, Lahore etc... look dramatic - you don't need a huge amount of radicals to carry those things out.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #14 - March 04, 2009, 01:34 PM

    Yes, I think I agree Nur, though I think it will be a sort of last desperate stand of a dying breed.

    But it will be in the short term - in fact we may have already seen the high point of it.


    Islam is more than a faith, its a huge culture-hijab & beards sheikh Muslimah a puritanical  lifestyle-:sloshed: no alcohol, no intermixing of the sexes etc & its this lifestyle which is under huge stress due to modernization. In the face of poverty & economic failure, its easy for a few tru radicals & some charlatans looking for power to convince people that Islam has the right answers to the problems plaguing Muslims.

    However, Islam, by the term Islam I mean Shariah, the Islamic way of living, doing business, the talaq does not have the aswers & it shouldn't take people too long to realise this. The rest of the world, the UN, even the dreaded U.S.A. style capitalism may not have all the answers either, but it sure has better, more plausible options. Saudi style beheadings & canings will get Muslims nowhere in the long run.

    As to radical Islam being a dying breed-thats' why radical Islam is violent. The biggest, most powerful stars burn brightest when they're dying. We're witnessing the passing awy into obscurity of a huge way of life.

    But this dying breed is taking a heck of a long run to die... don't you think so Hassan? 9\11, London, London, Madrid, Bali, Mumbai, Lahore... hell of a long, slow & painful death, painful for them as well as for loads of innocent people.

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #15 - March 04, 2009, 01:36 PM

    Yes, I think I agree Nur, though I think it will be a sort of last desperate stand of a dying breed.

    But it will be in the short term - in fact we may have already seen the high point of it.


    Islam is more than a faith, its a huge culture-hijab & beards sheikh Muslimah a puritanical  lifestyle- sloshed no alcohol, no intermixing of the sexes etc & its this lifestyle which is under huge stress due to modernization. In the face of poverty & economic failure, its easy for a few tru radicals & some charlatans looking for power to convince people that Islam has the right answers to the problems plaguing Muslims.

    However, Islam, by the term Islam I mean Shariah, the Islamic way of living, doing business, the talaq does not have the aswers & it shouldn't take people too long to realise this. The rest of the world, the UN, even the dreaded U.S.A. style capitalism may not have all the answers either, but it sure has better, more plausible options. Saudi style beheadings & canings will get Muslims nowhere in the long run.

    As to radical Islam being a dying breed-thats' why radical Islam is violent. The biggest, most powerful stars burn brightest when they're dying. We're witnessing the passing away into obscurity of a huge way of life, an accepted lifestyle for millennia for millions.

    But this dying breed is taking a heck of a long run to die... don't you think so Hassan? 9\11, London, London, Madrid, Bali, Mumbai, Lahore... hell of a long, slow & painful death, painful for them as well as for loads of innocent people.


    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #16 - March 04, 2009, 01:37 PM

    Just some silly ramblings.

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #17 - March 04, 2009, 01:38 PM

    hell of a long, slow & painful death, painful for them as well as for loads of innocent people.


    Name me one religion that didn't fade out in the same way?

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #18 - March 04, 2009, 01:40 PM

    hell of a long, slow & painful death, painful for them as well as for loads of innocent people.


    Name me one religion that didn't fade out in the same way?


    Hinduism has been around since dragons brav.  Cheesy
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #19 - March 04, 2009, 01:43 PM

    Hassan,
    Few radical individuals carrying attacks are not our only worries. The bigger issue is many young Muslims don not condemn extremism though most of them are decent and peaceful personally. It is not uncommon to read this across Muslim boards: 'We should not criticize Taliban or Mumbai attackers as all the information we get is modified by western media, whatever attackers did is between them and Allah and we should not support evil kaffirs accusing them'. And this attitude of young Muslims makes me worried that Islam is going to be more radical in the near future.


    Yes, I think I agree Nur, though I think it will be a sort of last desperate stand of a dying breed.

    But it will be in the short term - in fact we may have already seen the high point of it.

    Although attacks like Mumbai, Lahore etc... look dramatic - you don't need a huge amount of radicals to carry those things out.






  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #20 - March 04, 2009, 01:43 PM



    Hinduism has been around since dragons brav.  Cheesy


    True say, but I'm talking about the death of religions long gone by, and anyway hinduism has had it's fair share of bloodshed in the name of religion too.

    I'm just pointing out that religion dies through conquer and bloodshed, I haven't seen one that has faded out through peace.

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #21 - March 04, 2009, 01:59 PM



    Hinduism has been around since dragons brav.  Cheesy


    True say, but I'm talking about the death of religions long gone by, and anyway hinduism has had it's fair share of bloodshed in the name of religion too.

    I'm just pointing out that religion dies through conquer and bloodshed, I haven't seen one that has faded out through peace.


    Buddhism in India
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #22 - March 04, 2009, 02:01 PM

    That died out peacefully, completely peacefully?

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #23 - March 04, 2009, 02:34 PM


    But this dying breed is taking a heck of a long run to die... don't you think so Hassan? 9\11, London, London, Madrid, Bali, Mumbai, Lahore... hell of a long, slow & painful death, painful for them as well as for loads of innocent people.


    It is, but I am not surprised. We are talking about the worlds second largest religion with billions of followers and a long history.

    I think we need to take a longer view of things.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #24 - March 04, 2009, 02:42 PM

    Hassan,
    Few radical individuals carrying attacks are not our only worries. The bigger issue is many young Muslims don not condemn extremism though most of them are decent and peaceful personally. It is not uncommon to read this across Muslim boards: 'We should not criticize Taliban or Mumbai attackers as all the information we get is modified by western media, whatever attackers did is between them and Allah and we should not support evil kaffirs accusing them'. And this attitude of young Muslims makes me worried that Islam is going to be more radical in the near future.


    Yes, I think I agree Nur, though I think it will be a sort of last desperate stand of a dying breed.

    But it will be in the short term - in fact we may have already seen the high point of it.

    Although attacks like Mumbai, Lahore etc... look dramatic - you don't need a huge amount of radicals to carry those things out.



    Most Muslims don't support terrorist attacks like Mumbai etc...

    I agree that many will try to say "oh the cause of it is this or that" and make excuses in some way (which I agree is unacceptable) but I don't think it is right to say they would support such violence.

    It is the violent extremists who are willing to carry such things out that are main concern for me.

    I definitely agree that Muslims must stop this stupid cycle of "Anger Blame and Denial" - but most Muslims do not support the terrorists.

     
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #25 - March 04, 2009, 02:44 PM

    Hassan,
    I know Most Muslims dont support terrorist and they themselves will never harm anyone.
    But I do see they fail to condemn the terrorist activities.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #26 - March 04, 2009, 02:50 PM

    Hassan,
    I know Most Muslims dont support terrorist and they themselves will never harm anyone.
    But I do see they fail to condemn the terrorist activities.

    That's because they don't see what it has to do with them. They will see the attacks as non-Islamic therefore not relevant and they will yell at the media for using the term 'muslim' to increase hatred against muslims. I can see where they are coming from.
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #27 - March 04, 2009, 02:56 PM

    Hassan,
    I know Most Muslims dont support terrorist and they themselves will never harm anyone.
    But I do see they fail to condemn the terrorist activities.


    That is unfortunately true. Some of them ("moderate Muslims") feel that combats against terrorism or any talk of terrorism is malicious against Islam in nature. Even though most Western news agencies are very sensitive in this manner and try to avoid inflammatory language.

    "I am ready to make my confession. I ask for no forgiveness father, for I have not sinned. I have only done what I needed to do to survive. I did not ask for the life that I was given, but it was given nonetheless-and with it, I did my best"
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #28 - March 04, 2009, 03:10 PM

    That died out peacefully, completely peacefully?


    Yep mostly peacefully. Hindus accepted Buddha as one of their multiple gods which brought many Buddhists back into the folds of the faith, there were debates between the Hindu philosopher Shankaracharya and Buddhist monks, where Shankaracharya defeated some Buddhist monks but the death of Buddhism in Indian wasn't peaceful Buddhism in India might've been put on its death bed by the 11th century, a particular faith violently yanked off the life support.

    The faith? Islam. Much of the regions in the sub continent which are majority Muslim today were majority Buddhist. Islam first conquered Sind, a Buddhist majority region.

    The famous Buddhist University in India, Nalanda was a seat of higher learning from the 5th to the 12th centuries. It was sacked by the Turk Ikhtiyar ud din Muhammad bin Bakhtiyar Khalji. This medieval jihadi inquired whether the University had a Quran before proceeding to raze it down to the ground, put thousands of monks to their deaths....A few decades later, when a Tibetan scholar visited it, he found an old Buddhist monk Rahula something, teaching a group of 70 students in a ramshakle part of the building.  sad

    In its heyday, students from China, Japan, Tibet, Korea & Suvarnadwip(now Java) would visit it for higher learning, & spend years here. It died due to a foolish jihadi who could not appreciate all the higher learning it taught in theology, astronomy, chemistry & alchemy only as it didn't contain the book of hatred towards Jews, Christians & genocide towards idolaters called the Quran-which alone equalled more than all the tomes to  Muslim imperialists.  banghead

    So yep, there was indeed violence involved in the demise of Buddhism in India, but the violence was perpetrated by the same faith which is now carrying out its violent attacks from Bali to New York.  furious

    P.S. Something seems wrong with my comp, these options for modifying & removing posts are gone, so I was double posting. Sorry. comp26

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: The future of Islam
     Reply #29 - March 04, 2009, 03:18 PM

    So to end Islam (in the sub continent-which would be a major blow) we need to all convert to Buddhism and convert Muslims to Buddhists?

    I'm game

    Srsly though, I don't think Islam could die any more than Christianity could. Maybe one day when we are all super-rich and advanced in mentality, but until then we have to try something else.

    "I am ready to make my confession. I ask for no forgiveness father, for I have not sinned. I have only done what I needed to do to survive. I did not ask for the life that I was given, but it was given nonetheless-and with it, I did my best"
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