Who is still muslim?

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- billy
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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #120 - May 14, 2010, 05:41 PM

Quote from: debunker on May 14, 2010, 04:47 PM
Translate that for me, please..

oh, wait! are you saying that I'm oversimplifying things or that I'm being a simpleton or.... tsk, never mind. The next thing you're gonna say would probably fly way over my head too, anyway...

Oh debunker, I was just laughing at something. It doesn't matter.

"we can smell traitors and country haters"

Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
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Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.
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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #121 - May 14, 2010, 07:39 PM

Quote from: BlackDog on May 14, 2010, 01:02 PM
Aziz DB would say that means protectors and not friends but Hassan can you comment on that? Is it indeed friends or is it protectors?

Wali/Awliya doesn't mean friend in the sense the English word 'friend' (buddy, mate the guys you hang out with, roll with etc...) - that would probably be closer to sahib/ashab (companions) or Sadiq/asdiqaa' (erm... friends).

But having said that Awliya doesn't simply mean 'protectors' in the sense guardian or advocate or an agency of somesort - it means a much more than that.

In it's context it meant the sort of protection the tribe offered to individuals. In 7th century Arabia there was no sense of individual freedom or liberty as we have now - one existed as part of a tribe - the Aws or Khazraj etc... Islam replaced tribal allegiance/loyalty with allegiance/loyalty to Islam.

So regardless of how you translate Wali/Awliya - there is no doubt it is saying: "stick with Muslims - not non-Muslims"
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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #122 - May 14, 2010, 07:40 PM

Hassan this is why you got the POTM.
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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #123 - May 14, 2010, 07:46 PM

Quote from: abuyunus2 on May 14, 2010, 04:29 PM
lol, when you get back tell us more (was this the one your ex-wife drags you to?)

Yep lol... but I won't say anything about it out of respect to the good folks there - well apart from it was 'nice' lol
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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #124 - May 14, 2010, 07:49 PM

LOOOOOOOOOL!

I'm sure you had loads of fun!

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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #125 - May 14, 2010, 07:57 PM

Quote from: debunker on May 14, 2010, 04:51 PM
if you're really capable of allowing the idea of God to survive the Problem of Evil, since things might be beyond your understanding, then why wouldn't you categorize other troubling issues under the same banner of limited human understanding?

I'm quite willing to do that if I am able to do so.

The difference is that although 70/80 years of misery, pain and suffering in this world is a big problem for me believing in a God - I can still envisage the possibility that it leads to some good purpose for those who suffer. That our pain and misery in this life is in some way good for our souls and leads to some sort of end beyond this world that will benefit us and make the pain of this life worthwhile.

However I cannot envisage ANY possibility that might make eternal torture good for those who suffer it.

Which is why I hold the door open for God - but not the Qur'an.
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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #126 - May 14, 2010, 08:00 PM

Quote from: Hassan on May 14, 2010, 07:57 PM
I'm quite willing to do that if I am able to do so.

The difference is that although 70/80 years of misery, pain and suffering in this world is a big problem for me believing in a God - I can still envisage the possibility that it leads to some good purpose for those who suffer. That our pain and misery in this life is in some way good for our souls and leads to some sort of end beyond this world that will benefit us and make the pain of this life worthwhile.

However I cannot envisage ANY possibility that might make eternal torture good for those who suffer it.

Which is why I hold the door open for God - but not the Qur'an.

There is no hope for you brother, Allah has sealed your heart.
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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #127 - May 14, 2010, 08:23 PM

Quote from: Hassan on May 14, 2010, 07:57 PM
I'm quite willing to do that if I am able to do so.

The difference is that although 70/80 years of misery, pain and suffering in this world is a big problem for me believing in a God - I can still envisage the possibility that it leads to some good purpose for those who suffer. That our pain and misery in this life is in some way good for our souls and leads to some sort of end beyond this world that will benefit us and make the pain of this life worthwhile.

However I cannot envisage ANY possibility that might make eternal torture good for those who suffer it.

Which is why I hold the door open for God - but not the Qur'an.

yeah, of course Quran is out of the question for you... but I was sort of theorizing that you'd never committ to Deism either...

Of course, if you allow yourself to believe suffering is in some obscure way, good for people, then of course, the door is open for Deism (although something tells me you're not completely convinced -- how can a soul benifit from losing a limb, for example?)

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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #128 - May 14, 2010, 08:46 PM

Quote from: JohnnyKhan on May 14, 2010, 10:40 AM
no i have come to save!!
i have no doubt in
Lailahaillallah muhammad rasoolalah!!

Thanks!! I really needed that!! This will definitely keep me smiling for a long time!!!
JohnnyKhan I hope you say more funny stuff. I really like you!!

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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #129 - May 14, 2010, 09:05 PM

Quote from: debunker on May 14, 2010, 08:23 PM
Of course, if you allow yourself to believe suffering is in some obscure way, good for people, then of course, the door is open for Deism (although something tells me you're not completely convinced -- how can a soul benifit from losing a limb, for example?)

You're right - I'm far from convinced.

But whereas I confidently say "I don't believe in the Qur'an", I feel unable to say "I don't believe in God".

But equally I am unable to say "I believe in God".
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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #130 - May 14, 2010, 09:06 PM

Random question, but how was that Sufi event Hassan?

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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #131 - May 14, 2010, 09:09 PM

Quote from: Hassan on May 14, 2010, 07:46 PM
I won't say anything about it out of respect to the good folks there - well apart from it was 'nice' lol
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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #132 - May 14, 2010, 09:52 PM

Quote from: JohnnyKhan on May 14, 2010, 10:40 AM
no i have come to save!!

i have no doubt in

Lailahaillallah muhammad rasoolalah!!

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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #133 - May 14, 2010, 09:53 PM

btw where's Os these days?

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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #134 - May 14, 2010, 09:58 PM

Quote from: IsLame on May 14, 2010, 09:52 PM

That gif was born to be used for that post by Johnny

"we can smell traitors and country haters"

Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
God is Love.
Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.
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Re: Who is still muslim?
Reply #135 - May 14, 2010, 10:08 PM

Quote from: IsLame on May 14, 2010, 09:53 PM
btw where's Os these days?

I was wondering the same. The last time he logged in was on 8th of May.
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