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Theme Changer

 Topic: Islam in music

 (Read 9830 times)
  • 12 3 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Islam in music
     OP - June 27, 2010, 05:47 PM
    Ok when i was a muslim i always heard that music was haram, so why islam is so present in the music industry?? we've heard that michael jackson converted, and now it is busta rhymes and snoop dog wacko look at this rapper
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZFueqQnops
    since the beginning hiphop was friendly to islam, for exemple public enemy who were supporting nation of islam.
    or take for example this guy
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3rslpT5G8w
    Lol!! if it was really that cool to be muslim i wouldn't have left!! but i'am afraid if i go rapping like that at the mosque next friday they gonna kick me out!!
    but if islam is so much supported by music so why allah has forbidden it?? didn't he know it would be a good way to buy his product??
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #1 - June 27, 2010, 05:56 PM
    I don't think Nation of Islam are really considered muslim, are they?  They think Elijah Mohammed was a prophet, so they're kind of heretical.
    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #2 - June 27, 2010, 06:08 PM
    NOI is extremely heretical. Not only is Elijah Muhammed a prophet, Wallace Fard Muhammed was Allah on Earth according to NOI.

    But most Black Muslims in America nowadays aren't NOI, and a lot of the Black Muslim rap artists in the US are orthodox sunni.

    fuck you
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #3 - June 27, 2010, 06:12 PM
    Quote from: Cheetah on June 27, 2010, 05:56 PM
    I don't think Nation of Islam are really considered muslim, are they?  They think Elijah Mohammed was a prophet, so they're kind of heretical.

    That's right but it help to spread the original islam, since many of them finish to convert to orthodox islam, and here i'am not talking just about nation of islam (public enemy was just an exemple) but the whole islam is supported by lot of musicians, and i find that strange!!
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #4 - June 27, 2010, 06:12 PM
    it depends if you beleive the relavant hadiths or think it's just some bullshit someone made up. tbh the hadiths regarding music are a bit silly - apparently some instruments are ok to play and listen to but others are an abomination, lol.
    ''we are morally and philisophically in the best position to win the league'' - Arsene Wenger
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #5 - June 27, 2010, 06:18 PM
    Quote from: Q-Man on June 27, 2010, 06:08 PM
    But most Black Muslims in America nowadays aren't NOI, and a lot of the Black Muslim rap artists in the US are orthodox sunni.

    That's the problem, i have nothing against NOI(just the fact that they are pretty racist) but now lot of artists (even white) defend the sunny islamic ideology, it is crazy that islam is supported by something that is considered haram by many muslims!!!
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #6 - June 27, 2010, 06:20 PM
    Quote from: abuyunus2 on June 27, 2010, 06:12 PM
    it depends if you beleive the relavant hadiths or think it's just some bullshit someone made up. tbh the hadiths regarding music are a bit silly - apparently some instruments are ok to play and listen to but others are an abomination, lol.

    Anyway it should be a strange lifestyle to be a Gangsta-imam. dance
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #7 - June 27, 2010, 06:22 PM
    Quote from: abuyunus2 on June 27, 2010, 06:12 PM
    it depends if you beleive the relavant hadiths or think it's just some bullshit someone made up. tbh the hadiths regarding music are a bit silly - apparently some instruments are ok to play and listen to but others are an abomination, lol.

    Supposedly only the Daf is allowed in Islam.



    The reason being that Muhammad felt flattered by the Ansar playing the Daf as a welcome ceremony/celebration when he and Abu Bakr finally managed to reach Yathrib/Madinah from Makkah.

    Not the most coherent of choices for Musical artistry...
    Pakistan Zindabad? ya Pakistan sey Zinda bhaag?

    Long Live Pakistan? Or run with your lives from Pakistan?
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #8 - June 27, 2010, 06:24 PM
    Quote from: kero-zen on June 27, 2010, 06:18 PM
    That's the problem, i have nothing against NOI (just the fact that they are pretty very racist and homophobic)


    Fixed
    fuck you
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #9 - June 27, 2010, 06:29 PM
    Quote from: Q-Man on June 27, 2010, 06:24 PM
    Fixed

    you're pretty very right Cheesy
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #10 - June 27, 2010, 06:33 PM
    Quote from: abuyunus2 on June 27, 2010, 06:12 PM
    it depends if you beleive the relavant hadiths or think it's just some bullshit someone made up. tbh the hadiths regarding music are a bit silly - apparently some instruments are ok to play and listen to but others are an abomination, lol.


    what about the opion of the sahaba?

    Quote
    He connect that with mention of the doomed, those who turn away from the Qur'an and do not benefit from hearing the Words of Allah. Instead, they turn to listening to flutes and singing accompanied by musical instruments. As Ibn Mas`ud commented about the Ayah:

    [وَمِنَ النَّاسِ مَن يَشْتَرِى لَهْوَ الْحَدِيثِ لِيُضِلَّ عَن سَبِيلِ اللَّهِ]

    (And of mankind is he who purchases Lahu Al-Hadith to mislead (men) from the path of Allah), he said, "This -- by Allah -- refers to singing.''

    [وَمِنَ النَّاسِ مَن يَشْتَرِى لَهْوَ الْحَدِيثِ لِيُضِلَّ عَن سَبِيلِ اللَّهِ بِغَيْرِ عِلْمٍ]

    (And of mankind is he who purchases Lahw Al-Hadith to mislead (men) from the path of Allah without knowledge, ) Qatadah said: "By Allah, he may not spend money on it, but his purchasing it means he likes it, and the more misguided he is, the more he likes it and the more he prefers falsehood to the truth and harmful things over beneficial things.'' It was said that what is meant by the words

    [يَشْتَرِى لَهْوَ الْحَدِيثِ]

    (purchases idle talks) is buying singing servant girls.

    I'm an asshat.
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #11 - June 27, 2010, 06:39 PM
    Quote from: DigDug on June 27, 2010, 06:33 PM
    what about the opion of the sahaba?


    So what about the Daf??
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #12 - June 27, 2010, 06:44 PM
    nothing in the hadith can be trusted imho, whether alleged opinion of sahaba or otherwise. the fact is the majority were written centuries after Muhammads death - this is not a credible way to record history. before this they were passed down by word of mouth and i don't think it was intended that Muslims follow a religion based on something akin to chinese whisper, imo.
    ''we are morally and philisophically in the best position to win the league'' - Arsene Wenger
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #13 - June 27, 2010, 06:50 PM
    Abu, do you know how Quran was compiled?
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #14 - June 27, 2010, 06:51 PM
    Quote from: abuyunus2 on June 27, 2010, 06:44 PM
    nothing in the hadith can be trusted imho, whether alleged opinion of sahaba or otherwise. the fact is the majority were written centuries after Muhammads death - this is not a credible way to record history. before this they were passed down by word of mouth and i don't think it was intended that Muslims follow a religion based on something akin to chinese whisper, imo.


    You are entitled to your opinion but why do you then not question the validity of the hadith regarding prayer, fasting and hajj? (although the quote in question wasn't a hadith but an athar)

    I just find it strange that Muslims have fucked up the religion from day one and only we today have figured out the right path. And the only way we figured out the right path is by questioning hadith based on our own desires and not their actual authenticity.

    Although the hadith were only written down 200 years after muhammad's death they were preserved through oral tradition just the way the quran was. I don't see how people can question hadith and the actions of the salaf without then questioning the authenticity of the quran. (I personally chose to leave Islam rather than do this)

    I'm an asshat.
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #15 - June 27, 2010, 06:53 PM
    Quote from: Kenan on June 27, 2010, 06:50 PM
    Abu, do you know how Quran was compiled?


    in all fairness it was written down during the lifetime of Muhammad it just wasn't compiled into a book

    edit: but without a doubt it was corrupted in a chinese whispers way (imo) and there is evidence from Islamic sources supporting this
    I'm an asshat.
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #16 - June 27, 2010, 06:59 PM
    Quote from: DigDug on June 27, 2010, 06:51 PM
    You are entitled to your opinion but why do you then not question the validity of the hadith regarding prayer, fasting and hajj? (although the quote in question wasn't a hadith but an athar)

    I just find it strange that Muslims have fucked up the religion from day one and only we today have figured out the right path. And the only way we figured out the right path is by questioning hadith based on our own desires and not their actual authenticity.

    Although the hadith were only written down 200 years after muhammad's death they were preserved through oral tradition just the way the quran was. I don't see how people can question hadith and the actions of the salaf without then questioning the authenticity of the quran. (I personally chose to leave Islam rather than do this)



    the problem is that islam  concentrate more on stupid rules that talk about how to wear, or which hobbies we shouldn't have(listening to music) than on the spirituality we should have
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #17 - June 27, 2010, 07:00 PM
    Quote from: DigDug on June 27, 2010, 06:53 PM
    in all fairness it was written down during the lifetime of Muhammad it just wasn't compiled into a book

    edit: but without a doubt it was corrupted in a chinese whispers way (imo) and there is evidence from Islamic sources supporting this


    Not all of it though.
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #18 - June 27, 2010, 07:03 PM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 27, 2010, 07:00 PM
    Not all of it though.


    i know i was just trying to be objective though. I definitely get the feeling that the quran was intended to be preserved as an oral tradition just like the hadith (as this was the custom of the arabs).
    I'm an asshat.
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #19 - June 27, 2010, 07:04 PM
    Quote from: DigDug on June 27, 2010, 06:53 PM
    in all fairness it was written down during the lifetime of Muhammad it just wasn't compiled into a book

    edit: but without a doubt it was corrupted in a chinese whispers way (imo) and there is evidence from Islamic sources supporting this

    Afaik it was partially written down on paper, papyrus and just about anything else that was available at the time. The rest was provided by Hafizah. In this respect one could doubt the authenticity of Quran in much the same way Abu doubts the authenticity of hadith.

    And like you said there is evidence that present day Quran differs from older versions - we had a thread a while ago that presented archaeological evidence to support this - some old version of Quran was discoverd written in stone or something along those lines; I can't quite recall.
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #20 - June 27, 2010, 07:05 PM
    Quote from: DigDug on June 27, 2010, 07:03 PM
    i know i was just trying to be objective though. I definitely get the feeling that the quran was intended to be preserved as an oral tradition just like the hadith (as this was the custom of the arabs).


    This worries me. How can Muhammad not be smarter than this?

    Or Allah Tongue
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #21 - June 27, 2010, 07:11 PM
    Quote from: Kenan on June 27, 2010, 07:04 PM
    Afaik it was partially written down on paper, papyrus and just about anything else that was available at the time. The rest was provided by Hafizah. In this respect one could doubt the authenticity of Quran in much the same way Abu doubts the authenticity of hadith.

    And like you said there is evidence that present day Quran differs from older versions - we had a thread a while ago that presented archaeological evidence to support this - some old version of Quran was discoverd written in stone or something along those lines; I can't quite recall.


    I agree totally.

    Quote from: BlackDog on June 27, 2010, 07:05 PM
    This worries me. How can Muhammad not be smarter than this?

    Or Allah Tongue


    Yeah, a big part of the me leaving Islam was I couldn't believe that God would allow his religion to become so fucked up that you had to bend over backwards logically to understand it. And if you couldn't bring yourself to do that you would be punished in hell forever. It was supposed to be a clear message.
    I'm an asshat.
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #22 - June 27, 2010, 07:13 PM
    Where do you get your sources from?
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #23 - June 27, 2010, 07:16 PM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 27, 2010, 07:13 PM
    Where do you get your sources from?


    me? what sources?
    I'm an asshat.
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #24 - June 27, 2010, 07:19 PM
    Fapping sources.

    Grin

    Kidding, Islamic sources.
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #25 - June 27, 2010, 07:23 PM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 27, 2010, 07:19 PM
    Fapping sources.

    Grin

    Kidding, Islamic sources.


    lol

    the quote was from tafsir ibn kathir
    I'm an asshat.
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #26 - June 27, 2010, 07:27 PM
    Quote from: Kenan on June 27, 2010, 07:04 PM
    Afaik it was partially written down on paper, papyrus and just about anything else that was available at the time. The rest was provided by Hafizah. In this respect one could doubt the authenticity of Quran in much the same way Abu doubts the authenticity of hadith.

    And like you said there is evidence that present day Quran differs from older versions - we had a thread a while ago that presented archaeological evidence to support this - some old version of Quran was discoverd written in stone or something along those lines; I can't quite recall.

    isn't there were many version of the qu'ran which where compiled after mohamed's death and Abu Bakr choose one to be the real one and destroyed all the other??
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #27 - June 27, 2010, 07:29 PM
    Quote from: atheist.pk on June 27, 2010, 06:22 PM
    Supposedly only the Daf is allowed in Islam.

    (Clicky for piccy!)

    The reason being that Muhammad felt flattered by the Ansar playing the Daf as a welcome ceremony/celebration when he and Abu Bakr finally managed to reach Yathrib/Madinah from Makkah.

    Not the most coherent of choices for Musical artistry...

    isn't here a proof that islam was created by mohamed and no allah?
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #28 - June 27, 2010, 08:19 PM
    Quote from: kero-zen on June 27, 2010, 07:27 PM
    isn't there were many version of the qu'ran which where compiled after mohamed's death and Abu Bakr choose one to be the real one and destroyed all the other??

    I don't really know. What I do know is that it was first compiled in book form during the reign of Abu Bakr.
  • Re: Islam in music
     Reply #29 - June 27, 2010, 08:29 PM
    that's what an teacher said to me once, then i didn't thought further, but know it seems strange to me since there a surat where it tells that mohamed was reciting the qu'ran from a book:
     it is surat 98:al-baiyina in the beginning if i remember right.
    i hope someone can enlight this part
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
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