Skip navigation
Sidebar -

Advanced search options →

Welcome

Welcome to CEMB forum.
Please login or register. Did you miss your activation email?

Donations

Help keep the Forum going!
Click on Kitty to donate:

Kitty is lost

Recent Posts


Do humans have needed kno...
Today at 03:13 PM

Lights on the way
by akay
Yesterday at 10:04 PM

Gaza assault
Yesterday at 10:04 AM

AMRIKAAA Land of Free .....
February 03, 2025, 09:25 AM

The origins of Judaism
by zeca
February 02, 2025, 04:29 PM

Qur'anic studies today
by zeca
February 01, 2025, 11:48 PM

New Britain
February 01, 2025, 11:27 PM

Random Islamic History Po...
by zeca
February 01, 2025, 07:29 PM

اضواء على الطريق ....... ...
by akay
February 01, 2025, 11:55 AM

News From Syria
by zeca
December 28, 2024, 12:29 AM

Mo Salah
December 26, 2024, 05:30 AM

What music are you listen...
by zeca
December 25, 2024, 10:58 AM

Theme Changer

 Topic: Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?

 (Read 35012 times)
  • Previous page 1 ... 5 6 7« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Re: Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #180 - August 09, 2013, 06:21 AM

    Way to advance the discourse.


    So glad you approve.

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #181 - August 09, 2013, 06:25 AM

    So glad you approve.


    Didn't know that ad hominems are permitted on this forum.
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #182 - August 09, 2013, 06:26 AM

    Not an ad hominem. Was just showing my gratitude.

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #183 - August 09, 2013, 06:28 AM

    Hot.  Kiss
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #184 - August 09, 2013, 06:29 AM

    Isn't it just Wink

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #185 - August 09, 2013, 11:41 AM

    TonyT said ----------> Which I guess would not surprise me considering how much dislike there is for Jews in Islam?

    I respect your knowledge of history. But is this really borne out in reality. Compare and contrast with Christianity.


    Well both Christian and Muslim societies have had problems with Jews throughout history*. But in contemporary Islam, prejudice against Jews is a bigger problem than in Western societies. Now we could say that this has been exacerbated by Israel. But Jews were kicked out / fled from Arab countries en masse in 1948, at the very first year of the formation of Israel.

    *(But actualy, as a minority religion, Judaism got special priveleges in both Christian and Islamic societies. In fact it was one of the only religions that was tolerated at all, and the only reason that it survived where all other religions were eradicated.)
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #186 - August 09, 2013, 11:48 AM

    So when people argue for something you agree with (E.G.: atheism or the right to criticise religion in a depoliticised vein)  it's fine, but when people argue for something that isn't y'know, derealised and postmodern they're dicks?

    No. That's just some far-reaching conclusion you've drawn from following your own peculiar trails of reasoning and ending up in some entirely different place, not what I actually said.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #187 - August 09, 2013, 11:45 PM

    I don't care. And I don't really have an opinion on it. It was just an observation about the people who argue about it.


    I suppose it is a bloke thing. In the days before internet when you had make your own conversation there were four topics mostly covered by sixth form type boys. Sport(football mostly but other sports if they hated football), sex, (women/girls) , religion and politics.  The only ones who didn't talk about this stuff were guys actually having sex. Sport, sex, religion and politics are tribal. Blokes pick a side.

    I might be wrong above but the fact that there is - and there is no word to describe this yet - certain men who are racist towards other men of another colour but not the women. So they are sorta racist/sexist - are they rexist?. Must be a better word out there. I think there are much fewer women who think the same way.

    So the internet comes along, now you argue worldwide - I think sometimes the actual people get forgetton - and Israel/Palestine must be top five argument/meme? on the Internet.  Atheism/Theism possibly number 1, can't think of anymore at the moment. Israel/Palestine covers both religion and politics.

    Obviously it is not supported by the core gatekeepers of CEMB imo because it does not give the right image that CEMB wants to portray - I have no idea who these people CEMB have in mind. I don't think they want to see this debate because it gives a feel of old-school battles. Like - shit they still can't stop talking about Israel/Palestine  these ex-muslims can't have moved on much. It happens in other types of thread too.

    Personally, think there are plenty of Muslims who have left Islam, know that is bullshit but feel that their sense of 'morality' on the question of Israel/Palestine cannot be awashed away with it. We appreciate that the Palestinians can be their own worst enemies but what the Isreali's are doing is just Nazism Lite.

    Perhaps there are blokes out there who don't give a shit about anything or to be fairer exhibit zero-tribalism, I admire them but they are few and far between.


     

    I am my own worst enemy and best friend, itsa bit of a squeeze in a three-quarter bed, tho. Unhinged!? If I was a dog I would be having kittens, that is unhinged. Footloose n fancy free, forced to fit, fated to fly. One or 2 words, 3 and 3/thirds, looking comely but lonely, till I made them homely.D
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #188 - August 09, 2013, 11:52 PM

    Grin done


    As OP do I have the function of changing the title? If not can I re-name it?

    I am my own worst enemy and best friend, itsa bit of a squeeze in a three-quarter bed, tho. Unhinged!? If I was a dog I would be having kittens, that is unhinged. Footloose n fancy free, forced to fit, fated to fly. One or 2 words, 3 and 3/thirds, looking comely but lonely, till I made them homely.D
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #189 - August 10, 2013, 12:17 AM

    I suppose it is a bloke thing. In the days before internet when you had make your own conversation there were four topics mostly covered by sixth form type boys. Sport(football mostly but other sports if they hated football), sex, (women/girls) , religion and politics.  The only ones who didn't talk about this stuff were guys actually having sex. Sport, sex, religion and politics are tribal. Blokes pick a side.


    There's some truth to what you say here but considering the woman you are replying to regularly engages on the topics of religion and politics (as do most of the women on this forum, and a damn good number of women I know offline and independent of the internet, thankfully), I gotta say that at least in this context that's a bullshit response.

    Quote
    I might be wrong above but the fact that there is - and there is no word to describe this yet - certain men who are racist towards other men of another colour but not the women. So they are sorta racist/sexist - are they rexist?. Must be a better word out there. I think there are much fewer women who think the same way.


    The word is horny racists.

    Quote
    Obviously it is not supported by the core gatekeepers of CEMB imo because it does not give the right image that CEMB wants to portray - I have no idea who these people CEMB have in mind. I don't think they want to see this debate because it gives a feel of old-school battles. Like - shit they still can't stop talking about Israel/Palestine  these ex-muslims can't have moved on much. It happens in other types of thread too.

    Personally, think there are plenty of Muslims who have left Islam, know that is bullshit but feel that their sense of 'morality' on the question of Israel/Palestine cannot be awashed away with it. We appreciate that the Palestinians can be their own worst enemies but what the Isreali's are doing is just Nazism Lite.


    Now you're making more sense. I can say with all certainty that my support of Palestinian liberation is not now nor has it EVER been predicated on, or even related to, religion. I'm not Hindu either but I support the rights of the Tamil people against their largely Buddhist oppressors (even though if I were to choose between Hinduism and Buddhism I'd easily pick Buddhism). If more attention is paid to the struggle in Palestine than other places perhaps one might consider the crucial, and indeed primary, role of the world's most powerful empire in this situation for those of us who think imperialism is a really, really bad thing. The US doesn't give nearly as much money, military, diplomatic, and media/social support to any of the many other oppressor regimes it backs. Speaking personally, I'm quite furious that my pocket gets picked by my government to support this bullshit.

    fuck you
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #190 - August 10, 2013, 12:38 AM

    Don't get me wrong Q. Ishina et al could discuss those topics just like men, better than men. Women you meet, fair enough. Would it still be the same case across the board, not this board but in general men v women. I think men are more tribal than women. Take football, there can be serious hate for opposing fans not so much in women football, or is that the wrong example?

    Horny racists serious. I think I have come across say white men who imo do seem to have genuine empathy/sympathy for say brown women but hate the bloke. Or Asian blokes who do vice versa. Do women do the same? Perhaps not, or they don't horny enough to overcome the prejudice?

    I am my own worst enemy and best friend, itsa bit of a squeeze in a three-quarter bed, tho. Unhinged!? If I was a dog I would be having kittens, that is unhinged. Footloose n fancy free, forced to fit, fated to fly. One or 2 words, 3 and 3/thirds, looking comely but lonely, till I made them homely.D
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #191 - August 10, 2013, 12:47 AM

    Quote
    Take football, there can be serious hate for opposing fans not so much in women football, or is that the wrong example?


    Hah, you don't remember Aphrodite here?

    fuck you
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #192 - August 10, 2013, 12:53 AM

    Hah, you don't remember Aphrodite here?


    I do. Few and far between.

    I am my own worst enemy and best friend, itsa bit of a squeeze in a three-quarter bed, tho. Unhinged!? If I was a dog I would be having kittens, that is unhinged. Footloose n fancy free, forced to fit, fated to fly. One or 2 words, 3 and 3/thirds, looking comely but lonely, till I made them homely.D
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #193 - August 15, 2013, 12:45 PM

    Well both Christian and Muslim societies have had problems with Jews throughout history*. But in contemporary Islam, prejudice against Jews is a bigger problem than in Western societies. Now we could say that this has been exacerbated by Israel. But Jews were kicked out / fled from Arab countries en masse in 1948, at the very first year of the formation of Israel.

    *(But actualy, as a minority religion, Judaism got special priveleges in both Christian and Islamic societies. In fact it was one of the only religions that was tolerated at all, and the only reason that it survived where all other religions were eradicated.)


    For your perusal tonyt

    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=19917.0

    I am my own worst enemy and best friend, itsa bit of a squeeze in a three-quarter bed, tho. Unhinged!? If I was a dog I would be having kittens, that is unhinged. Footloose n fancy free, forced to fit, fated to fly. One or 2 words, 3 and 3/thirds, looking comely but lonely, till I made them homely.D
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #194 - August 15, 2013, 01:24 PM

    It was such a mistake - we now have

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/students-offered-grants-if-they-tweet-proisraeli-propaganda-8760142.html


    --------->In a campaign to improve its image abroad, the Israeli government plans to provide scholarships to hundreds of students at its seven universities in exchange for their making pro-Israel Facebook posts and tweets to foreign audiences. The students making the posts will not reveal online that they are funded by the Israeli government, according to correspondence about the plan revealed in the Haaretz newspaper,<--------

    Thought they had been doing this for years. Yeezeevee should be granted an honourary degree. Lol.


    The Israelis used similar thinking to make Israel or at least some of its cities the most gay friendly for miles around (not too hard). Seriously though, as a part of winning the minds and hearts of the world that matters to them. I have nothing against gay people but I do like to wind up the Christian Zionist - by asking them is this God's wish for Divine Israel to recreate Sodom and Gamorrah.

    I am my own worst enemy and best friend, itsa bit of a squeeze in a three-quarter bed, tho. Unhinged!? If I was a dog I would be having kittens, that is unhinged. Footloose n fancy free, forced to fit, fated to fly. One or 2 words, 3 and 3/thirds, looking comely but lonely, till I made them homely.D
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #195 - September 12, 2013, 07:41 AM

    Here is an interesting article from young Irish filmmmaker Nicky Larkin

    http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/nicky-larkin-being-a-true-supporter-of-israel-means-believing-in-palestine-too-29507665.html

    I realised that God was too much like man to be God. by prince Spinoza
  • Was the Creation of Modern Israel a Big Mistake?
     Reply #196 - September 12, 2013, 09:41 AM

    Just my 2 cents. I will not comment on what has/is happening in the area as many have said my thought on this. Instead I will focus on Canada and by extension America. After WW2 Jews naturally didn't want to return to their homes in France, Germany, Italy, etc. Seeing as many of these nations prior to the war held views of Jews that led to the Holocaust or had governments that actively discriminated Jews, France and Vichy France for example, this was to be expected. Many Jews wanted to immigrate to North America as the history of discrimination was not as well known or felt. Canada and America limited immigration which helped create the situation where Jews could either stay in Europe for good, wait for their chance to immigrate or immigrate to the Palestine Mandate. I believe by limiting immigration we slowed the pace of civil rights movement and the idea of equality within both nations. Although Canada already had civil rights in place in many areas were still dominated by European immigrants and their descendants. As per my intro this was still common during the 80s in central Canada. As the supposed heroes the allies were seen as we failed to live up to this image. Canada was on the committee that drew up the plans for partition voted on by the UN and also voted in support of the partition. Even as a minor power of the allies and UN Canada had an impact on the outcome we now see today in the area. This history is often never talked about at the high-school level. At present Canada considers Israeli one our closest allies. Our government does little to criticize Israeli. However there is a political movement that voices their opinion often enough that our government realizes not all Canadians support Israeli actions in the area.

    Even within archaeology and my plans for a career I hesitate when it comes looking for opportunities for employment in Israeli. There has been a few cases of Israeli's archaeology authorities have had the government demolish Palestinians homes in order to excavate ruins in the area. Also there still is a attempts with some archaeologist to use the field in order to promote claims to the area by archaeological findings. Although this has died down within Israeli, there is still a movement within America to use archaeology to promote one's religious views. This movement has sharply divided Archaeology in American between the field in general and what is now called "American Archaeology" This splinter group is often backed by religious figures and institutions following in the footsteps of Albright and his successors.

    I believe the creation of Israeli as a state was a mistake. There were other options but these were never in Canada's interest. This is a black-mark on the image of Canada being a friendly open nation many see at the present.
  • Previous page 1 ... 5 6 7« Previous thread | Next thread »