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Theme Changer

 Topic: Beheading in Woolwich

 (Read 37150 times)
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  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #90 - May 23, 2013, 03:15 PM

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22634095

    Quote
    Muslim organisations have failed to teach young people that there is a democratic route to express discontent, according to the Muslim Public Affairs Committee.

    Asghar Bukhari said that while organisations are "rightly" condemning the suspected terror attack in Woolwich, they have "washed their hands" of the youth.

    But he also blamed the government for failing to admit that there is a link between foreign policy and radicalisation.


    Quote from: ZooBear 

    • Surah Al-Fil: In an epic game of Angry Birds, Allah uses birds (that drop pebbles) to destroy an army riding elephants whose intentions were to destroy the Kaaba. No one has beaten the high score.

  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #91 - May 23, 2013, 03:22 PM

    Home grown attacks and plots here in the UK make me feel so much worse than the ones that happen abroad. This happened right next to the primary school that my cousins used to go to and it's incredibly upsetting when the attacks take place in locations and communities that you're familiar with. I hate these Islamist wankstains so much. They have no idea how much they've hurt the Muslim community in this country.

    19:46   <zizo>: hugs could pimp u into sex

    Quote from: yeezevee
    well I am neither ex-Muslim nor absolute 100% Non-Muslim.. I am fucking Zebra

  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #92 - May 23, 2013, 03:23 PM

    Reactions to attacks like this also hamper our cause. Ugh.
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #93 - May 23, 2013, 04:29 PM

    Gah. I literally feel queasy now. Even without the Islam element, just the image of a man with bloodied hands holding a meat cleaver with a body in the background in the middle of a street gives me this awful feeling inside vomit I didn't even watch the video, the pictures were horrid enough. 

    Fuck, what is wrong with some people. To kill someone so gruesomely no These guys seem like deranged psychopaths. 
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #94 - May 23, 2013, 04:30 PM

    lol musivore why do your posts always make me smile? XD 

    I know! It's uncanny. 
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #95 - May 23, 2013, 04:33 PM

    Islam just gives these people an excuse to do such crazy things.

    "Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

    'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #96 - May 23, 2013, 05:38 PM

    Do we bring his religion into what was a politically motivated act of violence? Interestingly, the entire problem with the IRA disappeared when the British troops left Ireland. Funny how that works.


    You are moving into the area of false equivocation and that's dangerous, because it kills any rational argument you might have. If we follow that stream of thought, then the Americans had every right to bomb and kill or enslave everyone in the 19th century, when American sailors were enslaved by Jihadist north-Africans. Didn't happen!

    Do we use the same measurement for the terrorist attacks by Polish/Jewish Holocaust-survivors on German soil, post-WWII?
    Oh wait! No such thing happened! By your logic, it would have been not only "normal", but also perfectly justified.
    What about Indian suicide-bombers on UK soil post-Indian emancipation? AGAIN! NO SUCH THING HAPPENED!

    What if it's a sign of Polish/Jewish/Indian MORAL superiority versus their oppressors?
    Surely, they follow different ideologies/religions and the political context was COMPLETELY different for all the examples.

    If we look at the history of the "clash of civilizations", in the context of centuries, then the simplistic view that the Muslims are the Eternal Victims gets a bit clearer and it's perfectly clear to see, that unlike in the Islamic world, the "Evil White Man" doesn't hide his crimes.

    The other aspect of the problem in your argument is, that even in times of ideological, absolute fascism (where the religious leaders and royals sang the same tune, that of superiority and entitlement), "the answer" was less worse than the initial problem.
    Why do we speak of the re-conquest of the Iberic peninsula (including Andalusia) as a bad thing, yet do not look at the invasion and destruction of North African and Spanish culture DURING the Jihadist Crusades that happened centuries earlier?

    If you think the problems we are facing today are strictly political, then you'd have to deny the reports of the millions of Iranians who supposedly saw the Moon standing still in the western parts of the sky, right when Ayatollah Khomeini came back to Iran. When we look at the pictures of people/universities pre- and post-1979, no matter if in Egypt, Algeria or Iran, do we not see something changed?
    Uniformity is only seen in the political context (Catholic Fascism in 30s Europe, Communist Eastern Europe post WWII), but Islam is not only a political doctrine or even dogma, it's first and foremost, a fascist, divinity-based ideology.

    So we can forget about the history of Europe/Near East/Northern Africa and let America move all it's troops back home, but then we will forget, that those states the radical Islam is coming from these days didn't need the USA to "sing the same tune" for over 1000 years.
    The pseudo-colonialist role of US military around the world is a sign of a dying empire and not the excuse for Jihadism, which existed centuries before Columbus set a foot on American soil.

    Religious fascism is schizophrenic; on one side, you have to be David and a victim, on the other hand feel like Goliath, because you claim to be ideologically and morally superior.

    Again, Western "Imperialsm" didn't turn Islamic states into the shitholes they are today; it just gives the Islamists a new excuse to blame it all on someone else and not their delusional ideology.
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #97 - May 23, 2013, 05:39 PM

    Smite

    _truth_ , you have been put on warning for asserting a notion of collective guilt and that innocent people 'deserve' to experience collective punishment.

    This will not be tolerated on this forum.

    This is your only warning. You will be banned from the forum if you step out of line again.




    Oh Shut up Billy seriously. Go ban me, its an internet forum I could careless.

    But fool who is standing up for these people huh?

    "In Brotherhood's Egypt, blasphemy charges against Christians surge ahead."

    http://news.yahoo.com/brotherhoods-egypt-blasphemy-charges-against-christians-surge-ahead-142935710.html

    You are sitting there crying about backlash, how do you think these people feel? In UK, the people going nuts and protesting against Muslims are in the minority. In Egypt its the majority that are ones that are targeting the minority Christians.

    So get out of here with your lovey dovey everthing is fine. Muslims have only themselves to blame for letting the extremists in their religion creep and not stop them when they actually had a chance.
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #98 - May 23, 2013, 05:41 PM

    Did you deserve the backlash when you were Muslim? Did I?


    As individuals no, as a member of a religion which does nothing to secularize or bring about democratic changes and progressivism to their society, yes
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #99 - May 23, 2013, 05:45 PM

    UK Muslim Group Condemns London Beheading Attack: SHOCKED
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTgFOnBLYPk

    "AUDIO TAPE" Mum talked down Woolwich brutal rogue  in Woolwich
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Q6blifekYw

    well let us hear David Cameron full pep talk
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56PeNXvmMXE

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #100 - May 23, 2013, 05:51 PM

    http://quran.com/8/12

    "strike upon their neck and fingertips"

    yeh guys, absolutely NOTHING to do with islam



    Thankfully 99.9 percent of muslims are good people who are better human beings then the islamic scriptures. Most muslims are ignorant of the violent instructions in the quran or ignore them, or they make a stupid explanation like the violent parts were for then(i'm yet to see the part of the quran where it says any of it is for a certain time)


    As much as I would love to agree, I would expect this forum to be the last place where verses are placed out of context.
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #101 - May 23, 2013, 05:51 PM

    Quote
    As individuals no, as a member of a religion which does nothing to secularize or bring about democratic changes and progressivism to their society, yes

    Oh Shut up Billy seriously. Go ban me, its an internet forum I could careless.

    But fool who is standing up for these people huh?

    "In Brotherhood's Egypt, blasphemy charges against Christians surge ahead."

    http://news.yahoo.com/brotherhoods-egypt-blasphemy-charges-against-christians-surge-ahead-142935710.html

    You are sitting there crying about backlash, how do you think these people feel? In UK, the people going nuts and protesting against Muslims are in the minority. In Egypt its the majority that are ones that are targeting the minority Christians.

    So get out of here with your lovey dovey everthing is fine. Muslims have only themselves to blame for letting the extremists in their religion creep and not stop them when they actually had a chance.


    _truth_ i know you are speaking bitter truth. But we have to realize a forum like this one are double edged swords.  One of the very important goals of CEMB is to get new Muslims members/readers  feel comfortable in that transient period where there is terrible confusion ..internal anger bout self and the life they lived or living with in Islam.  It is true nothing is fine and nothing is  lovey dovey  but fellows like you have the responsibility not to incite crowd at the same time lit a fire in the brain so they start using some common sense..


    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #102 - May 23, 2013, 05:55 PM

    As individuals no, as a member of a religion which does nothing to secularize or bring about democratic changes and progressivism to their society, yes

    What's the difference between an individual Muslim and a member of Islam?

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #103 - May 23, 2013, 05:55 PM

    As much as I would love to agree, I would expect this forum to be the last place where verses are placed out of context.

    kutta now it is your responsibility to explain that verse WITH IN THE CONTEXT OF EARLY ISLAM.. Let us put the verse along with translations.
    Quote

       إِذْ يُوحِي رَبُّكَ إِلَى الْمَلَائِكَةِ أَنِّي مَعَكُمْ فَثَبِّتُوا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا ۚ سَأُلْقِي فِي قُلُوبِ الَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا الرُّعْبَ فَاضْرِبُوا فَوْقَ الْأَعْنَاقِ وَاضْرِبُوا مِنْهُمْ كُلَّ بَنَانٍ

    Transliteration :    Ith yoohee rabbuka ila almalaikati annee maAAakum fathabbitoo allatheena amanoo saolqee fee quloobi allatheena kafaroo alrruAAba faidriboo fawqa alaAAnaqi waidriboo minhum kulla bananin
       
    Yusuf Ali :    Remember thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): "I am with you: give firmness to the Believers: I will instil terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them."
       
    Shakir :    When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.
       
    Pickthal :    When thy Lord inspired the angels, (saying): I am with you. So make those who believe stand firm. I will throw fear into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Then smite the necks and smite of them each finger.
       
    Mohsin Khan::    (Remember) when your Lord revealed to the angels, "Verily, I am with you, so keep firm those who have believed. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who have disbelieved, so strike them over the necks, and smite over all their fingers and toes.[/]"


    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #104 - May 23, 2013, 05:57 PM

    What's the difference between an individual Muslim and a member of Islam?


    Hmm.. Good question to all the members of this forum including those that are zebras.,  so let us answer that question..  Ishina it is your turn   

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #105 - May 23, 2013, 05:59 PM

    _truth_ i know you are speaking bitter truth.

    No he isn't. He's being a reactionary toolbag.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #106 - May 23, 2013, 06:05 PM

    What's the difference between an individual Muslim and a member of Islam?


    popcorn

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #107 - May 23, 2013, 06:16 PM

    No he isn't. He's being a reactionary toolbag.

     Really... what happened what did he say .. let me read it again..

    Quote
    Oh Shut up Billy seriously. Go ban me, its an internet forum I could careless.

    But fool who is standing up for these people huh?

    "In Brotherhood's Egypt, blasphemy charges against Christians surge ahead."

    http://news.yahoo.com/brotherhoods-egypt-blasphemy-charges-against-christians-surge-ahead-142935710.html

    You are sitting there crying about backlash, how do you think these people feel? In UK, the people going nuts and protesting against Muslims are in the minority. In Egypt its the majority that are ones that are targeting the minority Christians.

    So get out of here with your lovey dovey everthing is fine. Muslims have only themselves to blame for letting the extremists in their religion creep and not stop them when they actually had a chance.

    If I cross out  those bold words,  It is bitter truth..  Truth said these words in his post..

    1). Some one with in the Islamic group must stand up to these criminals who are Muslims use Literal sense from Islamic literature

    2). How do the people in Egypt , Pakistan, Bangladesh, Indonesia feel when the governments itself incarcerate people in the name of Blasphemy?  Worse is murdered on the roads by these so-called Islamic heroes?

    3).   Muslims have only themselves to blame for letting the extremists in their religion creep and not stop them when they actually had a chance

    That point three is indeed bitter truth... now your turn Ishina..

    And TRUTH.. ANSWER THE QUESTION

    Quote
    What's the difference between an individual Muslim and a member of Islam?


    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #108 - May 23, 2013, 06:21 PM

    Your novelty has worn off.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #109 - May 23, 2013, 06:24 PM

    Your novelty has worn off.

     well that is not helping, that doesn't help anything...

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #110 - May 23, 2013, 06:28 PM

    Ok well we waited and it seems "_truth_" has no answer to the question posed. No yeezeevee he's not speaking the "bitter truth", just acting bitter and dehumanising, collectivising people based on idiotic identity politics.

    You'll be going on an extended and long overdue vacation now, T. But maybe, if you ever have a moment beyond the bitter blanket hateful dogma you're perpetuating, try to think about how to be a better, kinder, wiser human being than those with whom you disagree. Your tendency towards simplistic ideologies is disturbing and I sincerely hope you educate yourself and learn to see people, especially those you disagree with, as full human beings, not just categories.

    Enjoy your vacation from this place.

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #111 - May 23, 2013, 06:49 PM

    The fact that they where using machetes is even more scary than a bomb.. I'm not going to watch the video, just seeing a picture of his bloody hands is just too much. :S
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #112 - May 23, 2013, 07:00 PM

    On which level are you speaking ? International ? England ?


    I was just talking about England. I would also add that at this stage secular Islam (Turkey, Indonesia and Tunisia, as well as a few other dictatorships) is on a life-support machine with liberal Islam all but dead. Frankly, right now Islam could do with a major reformation anyway but certainly a splash of liberalism wouldn't harm either. 

    Was it ever confirmed whether the murderers decapitated the soldier? If so I would be even more horrified then I already am but I haven't seen anything consistent from news sources on this point.
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #113 - May 23, 2013, 07:01 PM

    This event genuinely saddens me on many levels. Firstly, the tragic death of a young british soldier saddens me. The thoughts/feelings & what his family must be going through saddens me. The fact that a young man who identifies himself as a muslim feels a need to murder another young man in the name of Allah saddens me. The backlash that ordinary, everyday muslims are likely to have to see & endure saddens me.  The possibility of increased racism, bigotry & suspicion also saddens me.

    When truth is hurled against falsehood, falsehood perishes, for falsehood by its nature is bound to perish.
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #114 - May 23, 2013, 07:09 PM

    This event genuinely saddens me on many levels. Firstly, the tragic death of a young british soldier saddens me. The thoughts/feelings & what his family must be going through saddens me. The fact that a young man who identifies himself as a muslim feels a need to murder another young man in the name of Allah saddens me. The backlash that ordinary, everyday muslims are likely to have to see & endure saddens me.  The possibility of increased racism, bigotry & suspicion also saddens me.

     

    well whether we are sad or happy life goes on  Homo Sapien. But we don't want to travel backwards in time



    let me go and drink something..anything in the cup board..


    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #115 - May 23, 2013, 07:16 PM

    God, this is so awful.  This reminds me of the murder of Theo Van Gogh.

    European countries need to stand up, grow a pair and do something about this radicalization of Islam within their borders.   Multiculturalism has failed, a new approach is needed for dealing with immigration, especially from MENA and South Asia. Unemployment amongst Muslim youth is staggeringly high, this needs to be tackled by the government of those countries affected.  

    Things will only get worse before they get better.  Cry

    Atheism is a non-prophet organization.

    The sleeper has awakened -  Dune

    Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day Give him a religion, and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish!
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #116 - May 23, 2013, 07:52 PM



    Quote
    The soldier killed in an attack in London has been named as Drummer Lee Rigby of the 2nd Battalion the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers.

    Drummer Rigby, 25, from Manchester, leaves behind a two-year-old son.

    Two suspects shot by police after Wednesday's attack in Woolwich remain under arrest. A further two people have been arrested on conspiracy to murder.

    The two suspects who were shot, believed to include Michael Adebolajo, were known to security services.

    Scotland Yard said the latest arrests were of a man and woman, both aged 29.

    Drummer Rigby's family issued a statement on Thursday, saying: "Lee was lovely. He would do anything for anybody, he always looked after his sisters and always protected them. He took a 'big brother' role with everyone.

    "All he wanted to do from when he was a little boy, was be in the Army.

    "He wanted to live life and enjoy himself. His family meant everything to him. He was a loving son, husband, father, brother, and uncle, and a friend to many. "
    'Popular and witty'

    A post mortem examination was being carried out on Thursday.

    The Ministry of Defence also paid tribute to Drummer Rigby.

    "An extremely popular and witty soldier, Drummer Rigby was a larger than life personality within the Corps of Drums and was well known, liked and respected across the Second Fusiliers.

    "He was a passionate and life-long Manchester United fan."

    Drummer Rigby, from Middleton, Greater Manchester, joined the Army in 2006. He was described as a "loving father to his son Jack" and someone who would be "sorely missed by all who knew him".


    More here.

    Atheism is a non-prophet organization.

    The sleeper has awakened -  Dune

    Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day Give him a religion, and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish!
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #117 - May 23, 2013, 08:00 PM

    Quote
    So get out of here with your lovey dovey everthing is fine. Muslims have only themselves to blame for letting the extremists in their religion creep and not stop them when they actually had a chance.

    Wait, isn’t this the EXACT argument the terrorists use to kill innocent westerners? Muslims Americans have only themselves to blame for letting the extremists in their religion government creep and not stop them when they actually had a chance.
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #118 - May 23, 2013, 08:31 PM

    Wait, isn’t this the EXACT argument the terrorists use to kill innocent westerners? Muslims Americans have only themselves to blame for letting the extremists in their religion government creep and not stop them when they actually had a chance.


    That is a fair argument too from the Muslim Extremists perhaps. I guess a point could be made for if you don't agree with your government then you could for example not call yourself British for example. Same as if you don't agree with people literally interpreting in an extreme way your religion you could say that you were not a Muslim for example due to not wanting to be associated with a tarnished thing.

    This may be due to my upbringing of being bought up outside of my Passport country as a TCK therefore not feeling an affiliation anywhere, hating the question 'Where are you from?'. I do not associate myself with a Country or a Religious community, therefore I have no issues with feeling guilt for what 'my' government is doing.
  • Beheading in Woolwich
     Reply #119 - May 23, 2013, 08:33 PM

    The fact that they where using machetes is even more scary than a bomb.. I'm not going to watch the video, just seeing a picture of his bloody hands is just too much. :S

    Actually he came across as a mere mortal. Or a deranged madman waving a big knife in the middle of the street. The fact that a woman was standing in front of him talking to him made him look even more like a man in need of psychiatric help.

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
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