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 Topic: Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo

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  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #180 - January 09, 2015, 05:09 PM
    They just reported that 4 of the hostages were killed in the supermarket :/ :(
    You are the Universe, Expressing itself as a Human for a little while- Eckhart Tolle
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #181 - January 09, 2015, 05:14 PM
    Unsurprising that!
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #182 - January 09, 2015, 05:20 PM
    Quote from: suki on January 09, 2015, 04:46 PM
    Think it's over now, all gunmen killed except the girl i think so, all hostages survived..   apparently the UK is next and ours they said will be on a much larger scale  :/


    Britain has an industry of drawing Muhammad I'm not aware of?

    3 of the remaining 10 on the 2013 Al-Qaeda blasphemy hit list are Danish. The only Brit is Salman Rushdie.

    EDIT: Opportunity is of course a huge factor of where the next attack in our part of the world will come though.
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  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #183 - January 09, 2015, 05:35 PM
    Quote from: Nikolaj on January 09, 2015, 05:20 PM
    Britain has an industry of drawing Muhammad I'm not aware of?

    3 of the remaining 10 on the 2013 Al-Qaeda blasphemy hit list are Danish. The only Brit is Salman Rushdie.

    EDIT: Opportunity is of course a huge factor of where the next attack in our part of the world will come though.


    As some recent articles have highlighted, I think it is a mistake to think that it is actually about cartoons - but rather about increasing tension between Muslims and non-Muslims.

    I know many people who are saying; "Why are these people doing this it will only help the far-right and anti-Islam brigade and harm Muslims living in the West in the long-term"

    Well that's exactly what they want to do.

    The specific target is not the real issue - except in as far as it helps turn up the heat for Muslims here and pushes more into the arms of extremists.

    It's about recruiting - not cartoons.
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #184 - January 09, 2015, 05:41 PM
    Quote from: Nikolaj on January 09, 2015, 05:20 PM
    Britain has an industry of drawing Muhammad I'm not aware of?

    3 of the remaining 10 on the 2013 Al-Qaeda blasphemy hit list are Danish. The only Brit is Salman Rushdie.

    EDIT: Opportunity is of course a huge factor of where the next attack in our part of the world will come though.


    Hey, yep MI5 just put out a warning today saying that al-qaida in syria have plotted a major attack on the uk in many locations, on a massive scale and claimed that they are not able to prevent every attack apparently.
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #185 - January 09, 2015, 07:12 PM
    Woop dee doo

    Quote
    President Francois Hollande says French nation "mustn't be divided" & gunmen had "nothing to do with Muslim faith" http://bbc.in/1ARVl68


    https://twitter.com/BBCBreaking/status/553628027935268867
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #186 - January 09, 2015, 07:27 PM
    Quote from: Abu Ali on January 09, 2015, 05:35 PM
    As some recent articles have highlighted, I think it is a mistake to think that it is actually about cartoons - but rather about increasing tension between Muslims and non-Muslims.


    But wouldn't 7/7- or Madrid-style attacks work better at that?

    Charlie Hebdo pissed everyone off. Their latest edition before the attack was mocking anti-Muslim bigots. Why attack them then?
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  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #187 - January 09, 2015, 07:38 PM
    Quote from: Abu Ali on January 09, 2015, 05:35 PM
    As some recent articles have highlighted, I think it is a mistake to think that it is actually about cartoons - but rather about increasing tension between Muslims and non-Muslims.

    I know many people who are saying; "Why are these people doing this it will only help the far-right and anti-Islam brigade and harm Muslims living in the West in the long-term"

    Well that's exactly what they want to do.

    The specific target is not the real issue - except in as far as it helps turn up the heat for Muslims here and pushes more into the arms of extremists.

    It's about recruiting - not cartoons.


    Makes sense. But twisted. That's them, not you Abu. You are just the sense part.
    Hi
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #188 - January 09, 2015, 07:44 PM
    They want to start a civil war. They want Europeans to turn on Muslims and attack them. They want to provoke that, its what they want.
    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #189 - January 09, 2015, 10:34 PM
    Quote from: Nikolaj on January 09, 2015, 07:27 PM
    But wouldn't 7/7- or Madrid-style attacks work better at that?

    Charlie Hebdo pissed everyone off. Their latest edition before the attack was mocking anti-Muslim bigots. Why attack them then?


    Sadly some Muslims would regard the magazine as a fair target. Much more so that random passengers on a train or bus.

    They want to attract the foolish young disaffected Muslims towards them by showing they are the defenders of true Islam - while at the same time turn Westerners against Muslims, by attacking the thing Westerners cherish deeply - free speech.

    These guys (behind the rank and file cannon-fodder) are really that cynical. They are cold, calculated and know exactly what they are doing.
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #190 - January 09, 2015, 10:37 PM
    Quote from: billy on January 09, 2015, 07:44 PM
    They want to start a civil war. They want Europeans to turn on Muslims and attack them. They want to provoke that, its what they want.


    This^

    And in this they are at one with far-right bigots and xenophobes.
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #191 - January 09, 2015, 10:44 PM
    wonder what happend to the girl who held the people hostage at the kosher supermarket, she has dissapeared..
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #192 - January 09, 2015, 10:48 PM
    Quote from: Abu Ali on January 09, 2015, 10:37 PM
    This^

    And in this they are at one with far-right bigots and xenophobes.


    Yep. At the same time, wider issue of social cohesion can only be resolved if Muslims take a step towards everyone else and embrace secular liberal values and reconcile themselves to European societies without antagonism. Sadly there are whole infrastructures of religious dogmatists trying to distance them from what they want to project as lands of 'kuffar'. Its a two way street.
    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #193 - January 09, 2015, 10:49 PM
    "He who knows best how to employ the fox has succeeded best, but it is necessary to know well how to disguise this characteristic, and to be a great pretender and dissembler. Men are so simple, and so subject to present necessities, that he who seeks to deceive will always find someone who will allow himself to be deceived… Therefore it is unnecessary for a prince to have all the good qualities I have enumerated, but it is very necessary to appear to have them. And I shall dare to say this also, that to have them and always to observe them is injurious, and that to appear to have them is useful; to appear merciful, faithful, humane, religious, upright, and to be so, but with a mind so framed that should you require not to be so, you may be able and know how to change to the opposite."

    Nicolo Machiavelli

  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #194 - January 09, 2015, 11:14 PM
     There's no doubt that the people at the top of these organisations have some very cynical and calculated intentions.
    They want not just to provoke division and unrest but at the same time to see how far they can go and test the resolve not just of governments but the populace as a whole . It's a win- win scenario for them , elicit a draconian response and they can present it as proof of 'the war on islam'  and recruit more naïve youngsters , find their actions met with a more measured response and it's proof of the weakness of the non-believers (and their moderate muslim 'fellow travellers')
         I think there is also some more traditional , if bloody , politicking going on
    I don't think up till now we have seen so many powerful and apparently quite well supported groups operating at the same time.  They're not immune from the kind of petty disputes that used to plague the left (when we still had a left...)
     I can't help wondering if part of the motivation for the horrific attack in Nigeria today was Boko Haram feeling upstaged and trying to assert themselves as top psychopaths.
       That said , I wouldn't dismiss the cartoon issue. I know some people object to the term 'islamofascism' , but I think it's the best description for what is going on here. This is an extreme , totalitarian movement which cannot tolerate any dissent or questioning and will crush anyone who speaks up "pour encourager les autres" - these are people who shoot little girls for going to school and beat men for having the wrong length beard .
       This is why it's disappointing the British press didn't join our neighbours in publishing the cartoons. I don't blame Jylends Post for not getting involved , they've had their share already , but if we don't take a stand and show some solidarity we're in danger of finding everything we read , watch or listen to being dictated by fanatics
     
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #195 - January 09, 2015, 11:59 PM
    Dig this article...  wacko

    Quote
    When faced with a terrorist attack against a satirical newspaper, the appropriate response seems obvious. Don’t let the victims be silenced. Spread their work as far as it can possibly go. Laugh in the face of those savage murderers who don’t understand satire.

    In this case, it is the wrong response.

    Here’s what’s difficult to parse in the face of tragedy: yes, Charlie Hebdo is a French satirical newspaper. Its staff is white. Its cartoons often represent a certain, virulently racist brand of French xenophobia. While they generously claim to ‘attack everyone equally,’ the cartoons they publish are intentionally anti-Islam, and frequently sexist and homophobic.


    Quote
    Even in a fresh-off-the-press, glowing BBC profile of Charb, Hebdo’s murdered editor, he comes across as a racist asshole.

    Charb had strongly defended Charlie Hebdo’s cartoons featuring the Prophet Muhammad.

    “Muhammad isn’t sacred to me,” he told the Associated Press in 2012, after the magazine’s offices had been fire-bombed.

    “I don’t blame Muslims for not laughing at our drawings. I live under French law. I don’t live under Koranic law.”


    In the Wake of Charlie Hebdo, Free Speech Does Not Mean Freedom From Criticism

    Found through this debate at
    (Facebook) The Middle Eastern Feminist    . You might want to dig some of the comments.

    As I'm a privileged white male who didn't read the magazine nor would be able to because of lack of linguistic skills never mind knowledge of French politics I would like to hear opinions from some of you victims of the magazine?
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  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #196 - January 10, 2015, 12:12 AM
    Quote from: Lilyesque on January 09, 2015, 07:12 PM
    Woop dee doo

    https://twitter.com/BBCBreaking/status/553628027935268867


    Most people won't discriminate between the teachings of the Islamic faith and Muslims as people, so he pretty much has to say something like that to protect their safety I think.
    Quote from: yeezevee on February 11, 2016, 02:05 PM
    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #197 - January 10, 2015, 12:15 AM
     So the boys with the balaclavas and the Kalashnikovs are just defending women from rape jokes ?!!!
    I am white , but I'm not male and I don't consider myself particularly privileged. I'm offended every day , but so what ?
    I don't need the police or the courts to protect me from ignorant fools , never mind a bullet.
    If I was a woman in the middle east I think I'd be a bit more concerned about the people interfering with my right to get an education ,work  , choose who to marry etc , than with a drawing in a newspaper in another country.
     And please explain how saying  " mohammed isn't sacred to me " or "I don't live under koranic law" makes someone racist
      
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #198 - January 10, 2015, 12:17 AM
    We can't understand how that is racist obviously because we are whites
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  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #199 - January 10, 2015, 12:19 AM
    - SOME people won't discriminate between extremists and muslims  , but I don't think it's most people
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #200 - January 10, 2015, 12:24 AM
    F****** fuming at what happened. It was a shame that the suspects were killed. They should have suffered for what they did.

    I can see that Muslims were offended by the images printed, but they never caused death amongst the Muslim communities.

    Generally, if you don't like expression of certain things in a country that you are not from, then please...just go back to the shit hole you wormed your way out from.
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #201 - January 10, 2015, 12:30 AM
    Quote from: aife on January 10, 2015, 12:19 AM
    - SOME people won't discriminate between extremists and muslims  , but I don't think it's most people

    Obviously. I was being ironic Smiley Should have added an emote.
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  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #202 - January 10, 2015, 12:53 AM
    Quote from: aife on January 09, 2015, 11:14 PM
    I can't help wondering if part of the motivation for the horrific attack in Nigeria today was Boko Haram feeling upstaged and trying to assert themselves as top psychopaths.
     


    I had the same thought.

    It would be funny if it wasn't so sad.
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #203 - January 10, 2015, 12:57 AM
    Quote from: asbie on January 10, 2015, 12:12 AM
    Most people won't discriminate between the teachings of the Islamic faith and Muslims as people, so he pretty much has to say something like that to protect their safety I think.


    Yep.
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #204 - January 10, 2015, 12:58 AM
    Quote from: aife on January 10, 2015, 12:19 AM
    - SOME people won't discriminate between extremists and muslims  , but I don't think it's most people


    Yes. Some.
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #205 - January 10, 2015, 01:03 AM
    Quote from: Nikolaj on January 10, 2015, 12:17 AM
    We can't understand how that is racist obviously because we are whites


    Oh that's right! It's the WHITE MANS fault...again! I knew that all my taxi driver friends were right!  Tongue
    No free mixing of the sexes is permitted on these forums or via PM or the various chat groups that are operating.

    Women must write modestly and all men must lower their case.

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  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #206 - January 10, 2015, 01:13 AM
    Quote from: aife on January 09, 2015, 11:14 PM
    I can't help wondering if part of the motivation for the horrific attack in Nigeria today was Boko Haram feeling upstaged and trying to assert themselves as top psychopaths.


    It wasn't today. It was... on the same day as the initial killings in Paris, Wednesday...

    They reportedly overran an army base Saturday and launched their massacre in Baga Wednesday.

    I still haven't figured out if they did that before or after the killings in Paris became public knowledge. Boko Haram would be able to do that shit on itself.
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  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #207 - January 10, 2015, 01:21 AM
    Quote from: Nikolaj on January 09, 2015, 05:20 PM
    Britain has an industry of drawing Muhammad I'm not aware of?

    3 of the remaining 10 on the 2013 Al-Qaeda blasphemy hit list are Danish. The only Brit is Salman Rushdie.


    Where is this hit list?
  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #208 - January 10, 2015, 01:25 AM


    It is from 2013 (I added the red cross on Stephane Charbonne).

    Carsten Luste, Kurt Westergaard and Flemming Rose are Danish.
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  • Deadly attack on office of French magazine Charlie Hebdo
     Reply #209 - January 10, 2015, 01:35 AM
    Quote from: Nikolaj on January 09, 2015, 11:59 PM
    Dig this article...  wacko

    In the Wake of Charlie Hebdo, Free Speech Does Not Mean Freedom From Criticism

    Found through this debate at
    (Facebook) The Middle Eastern Feminist    . You might want to dig some of the comments.

    As I'm a privileged white male who didn't read the magazine nor would be able to because of lack of linguistic skills never mind knowledge of French politics I would like to hear opinions from some of you victims of the magazine?


    This sound terribly like “I know it's a tragedy, but...” to me. Sorry, I am probably also in a position of privilege in terms of racism, since I have never lived in any country where my ethnicity is not the dominant one, so no idea how much value my comment is. But, just my feeling when I saw the article.
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