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Theme Changer

 Topic: Peace, All

 (Read 192896 times)
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  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #570 - June 21, 2010, 11:38 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 11:36 PM
    Of course you should use it!  But give Him the benefit of the doubt that He knows what He is talking about.  Use the concept of "No god but the One God" as a mathematical truth in it (like '0' in math or something.)


    You're joking right? I know you're trolling now Smiley

    Actually I kinda admire your level of trolling, it's quite ingenious.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #571 - June 21, 2010, 11:38 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 11:30 PM
    Considering no other leader from before Him managed to put two-and-two together the way you're implying, I think it's obvious that we did need God to say something (wait... aren't you meatheads arguing for it too???  lol).

    "Other religions such as Hinduism also view menstruation in a negative light.[7] In the Hindu faith, women are prohibited from participating in normal life while menstruating. She must be "purified" before she is allowed to return to her family. In South India, women who are menstruating are not allowed in the household for a period of 3 nights."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Menstrual_taboo#In_religion

    Lots of religions have menstrual taboos. Islam has it's own, too.
    I know someday you'll have a beautiful life, I know you'll be a star
    In somebody else's sky, but why, why, why
    Can't it be, can't it be mine

    https://twitter.com/AlharbiMoe
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #572 - June 21, 2010, 11:40 PM
    Quote from: Zebedee on June 21, 2010, 11:37 PM
    You know, it's funny that Allah never said menstruating women shouldn't have intercourse because they'll get cramps. He said that men shouldn't go near women because it's 'unclean.'

    You'll catch period-disease if you go near menstruating women!!


    lol

    Dude, he was addressing the menfolk for the most part because it was a patriarchal society.  If it just happened to be a matriarchal one, I'm sure He would've phrased it the other way.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #573 - June 21, 2010, 11:41 PM
    Quote from: Q-Man on June 21, 2010, 11:28 PM
    What about buttsex Rasheed?


    It's haraaaaaaam

    From Tafsir Ibn Kathir:

    Anal Sex is prohibited

    Allah said:

    [مِنْ حَيْثُ أَمَرَكُمُ اللَّهُ]


    (...as Allah has ordained for you.) this refers to Al-Farj (the vagina), as Ibn `Abbas, Mujahid and other scholars have stated. Therefore, anal sex is prohibited, as we will further emphasize afterwards, Allah willing. Abu Razin, `Ikrimah and Ad-Dahhak and others said that:

    Imam Ahmad reported that Khuzaymah bin Thabit Al-Khatami narrated that Allah's Messenger said:


    «لَا يَسْتَحْيِي اللهُ مِنَ الْحَقِّ ثَلَاثًا لَا تَأْتُوا النِّسَاءَ فِي أَعْجَازِهِن»


    (Allah does not shy from the truth - he said it thrice-, do not have anal sex with women.)


    This Hadith was collected by An-Nasa'i and Ibn Majah.


    Abu `Isa At-Tirmidhi and An-Nasa'i reported that Ibn `Abbas narrated that Allah's Messenger said:


    «لَا يَنْظُرُ اللهُ إِلى رَجُلٍ أَتَى رَجُلًا أَوِ امْرَأَةً فِي الدُّبُر»


    (Allah does not look at a man who had anal sex with another man or a woman.)
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #574 - June 21, 2010, 11:41 PM
    Quote from: Zebedee on June 21, 2010, 11:37 PM
    You know, it's funny that Allah never said menstruating women shouldn't have intercourse because they'll get cramps. He said that men shouldn't go near women because it's 'unclean.'

    You'll catch period-disease if you go near menstruating women!!

    When it comes to religion, menstruation is often seen as filth and impurity.
    I know someday you'll have a beautiful life, I know you'll be a star
    In somebody else's sky, but why, why, why
    Can't it be, can't it be mine

    https://twitter.com/AlharbiMoe
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #575 - June 21, 2010, 11:43 PM
    Quote from: MoeAlharbi on June 21, 2010, 11:38 PM
    "Other religions such as Hinduism also view menstruation in a negative light.[7] In the Hindu faith, women are prohibited from participating in normal life while menstruating. She must be "purified" before she is allowed to return to her family. In South India, women who are menstruating are not allowed in the household for a period of 3 nights."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Menstrual_taboo#In_religion

    Lots of religions have menstrual taboos. Islam has it's own, too.


    Oh.  That's what I get for piggybacking off of the idea that Muhammad "made it up" implied by whoever that was.  

    See?  You can see the consistency in the message through the thread of the world's faiths!  Obviously it wasn't considered important enough to get tampered with very much over the ages...
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #576 - June 21, 2010, 11:44 PM
    Quote from: Zebedee on June 21, 2010, 11:41 PM
    It's haraaaaaaam

    From Tafsir Ibn Kathir:

    Anal Sex is prohibited

    Allah said:

    [مِنْ حَيْثُ أَمَرَكُمُ اللَّهُ]


    (...as Allah has ordained for you.) this refers to Al-Farj (the vagina), as Ibn `Abbas, Mujahid and other scholars have stated. Therefore, anal sex is prohibited, as we will further emphasize afterwards, Allah willing. Abu Razin, `Ikrimah and Ad-Dahhak and others said that:

    Imam Ahmad reported that Khuzaymah bin Thabit Al-Khatami narrated that Allah's Messenger said:


    «لَا يَسْتَحْيِي اللهُ مِنَ الْحَقِّ ثَلَاثًا لَا تَأْتُوا النِّسَاءَ فِي أَعْجَازِهِن»


    (Allah does not shy from the truth - he said it thrice-, do not have anal sex with women.)


    This Hadith was collected by An-Nasa'i and Ibn Majah.


    Abu `Isa At-Tirmidhi and An-Nasa'i reported that Ibn `Abbas narrated that Allah's Messenger said:


    «لَا يَنْظُرُ اللهُ إِلى رَجُلٍ أَتَى رَجُلًا أَوِ امْرَأَةً فِي الدُّبُر»


    (Allah does not look at a man who had anal sex with another man or a woman.)


    Nah Sistani says its cool.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #577 - June 21, 2010, 11:45 PM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 21, 2010, 11:38 PM
    You're joking right? I know you're trolling now Smiley

    Actually I kinda admire your level of trolling, it's quite ingenious.




    How can you tell if someone is a troll or not?
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #578 - June 21, 2010, 11:45 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 11:40 PM
    lol

    Dude, he was addressing the menfolk for the most part because it was a patriarchal society.  If it just happened to be a matriarchal one, I'm sure He would've phrased it the other way.


    Oh, no doubt.  It's just funny that the Word of God talks about menstruation from the same unenlightened perspective as other phallocentric scriptures.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #579 - June 21, 2010, 11:47 PM
    Quote from: IsLame on June 21, 2010, 11:32 PM
    Sorry, I got it wrong.  The Quran only says a messenger was sent to every group of people during all time.  The actual figure quoted is from the weak hadith.  However I dont think that this changes the premise of my original post so it still holds true.


    You were right, of course.  That's exactly what I would have said.

    Wanna cookie?   Smiley
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #580 - June 21, 2010, 11:48 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 11:45 PM
    (Clicky for piccy!)

    How can you tell if someone is a troll or not?


    Because equating 0 existing as evidence comparable with the evidence for God's existence is nonsensical. I don't want to think you're being serious so I'll say you're just having a laugh at us. It's cool  Afro

    My other option is to think you're being dead serious, I rather not do that, it will bring you a peg or two down my list of cool.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #581 - June 21, 2010, 11:48 PM
    Quote from: Zebedee on June 21, 2010, 11:45 PM
    Oh, no doubt.  It's just funny that the Word of God talks about menstruation from the same unenlightened perspective as other phallocentric scriptures.


    You're being ridiculous.

    When they discover a direct link from menses sex to womb cancer or something, you'd better eat those words.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #582 - June 21, 2010, 11:50 PM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 21, 2010, 11:44 PM
    Nah Sistani says its cool.


    Yeah, but Shiites are goddamn dirty deviants  grin12
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #583 - June 21, 2010, 11:50 PM
     dance
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #584 - June 21, 2010, 11:50 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 11:48 PM
    You're being ridiculous.

    When they discover a direct link from menses sex to womb cancer or something, you'd better eat those words.


     wacko
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #585 - June 21, 2010, 11:51 PM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 21, 2010, 11:48 PM
    Because equating 0 existing as evidence comparable with the evidence for God's existence is nonsensical. I don't want to think you're being serious so I'll say you're just having a laugh at us. It's cool  Afro

    My other option is to think you're being dead serious, I rather not do that, it will bring you a peg or two down my list of cool.


    I was being very serious, BlackDog.  Existence is worthless without God.  It's better to embed it within your studies as a fundamental truth so you don't eff up and lose your faith or something crazy.

    oops...
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #586 - June 21, 2010, 11:54 PM
    Quote from: Hassan on June 21, 2010, 10:05 PM
    No, it's that you say things like 'You need to keep acting like a Muslim till you believe because otherwise you will burn in Hell!'


    Well, yeah.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #587 - June 21, 2010, 11:55 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 11:54 PM
    Well, yeah.


    In other words, be a munaafiq
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #588 - June 21, 2010, 11:56 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 11:51 PM
    I was being very serious, BlackDog.  Existence is worthless without God.  It's better to embed it within your studies as a fundamental truth so you don't eff up and lose your faith or something crazy.

    oops... (Clicky for piccy!)


    I have no problems in believing in God Wink

    I have problems finding credible and convincing evidence for God. Specifically the Personal God.

    In the end my philosophy is to do good. Hopefully I leave this world having done good. If a God wants to send me to hell who am I to say no. If He/She/It/Them chooses to send me somewhere else I have no say in the matter.

    In any case I will go up or down like a man. I don't cower or fear because my heart is pure. If there is a God He/She/It/Them should know I loved with my heart and believed with my heart.

    I just can't believe unless there is evidence, I don't trust blind faith anymore because it could mean you believe in practically anything. And I have a rational and logical mindset. It has taken us many places, shined its light in the dark crevices of our history and we have emerged enlightened. Science is based on this mindset, and it is one I respect, it works in the real world. I trust it.

    Btw the reason why I left Islam was because of too many questions, and the answer from Muslim scholars felt like they were trying to answer in a positive light and not in a rational or objective manner. They read it with God-goggles and without those goggles I see the cracks in the edifice. I see the loose threads in the binding. I don't force myself to see it this way, I try to be fair. But it's there.

    I suggest you do the same brother Smiley
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #589 - June 22, 2010, 12:00 AM
    I said:"2.)  Only Allah is the Judge who will know people's final destinations.  I cannot know that man's soul."

    Quote from: Q-Man on June 21, 2010, 09:44 PM
    Wait, this contradicts what you said earlier when you said ex-Muslims are hellbound, and when you said someone who does not believe in God and his message, who has more good deeds than bad, etc. will go to hell.


    I'm talking about on the level of God being the one who knows more about what an individual did during his lifetime as to whether he really made the cut or not.  I don't watch people that closely.  Only Allah does.  From the outside we can THINK we know whether a person is truly living up to it or not, but God will have the true tally.  Get me?

    You can't have it both ways. If Allah is sole judge of people's souls and you cannot know his judgment then you can't go around making statements about who goes to hell and who doesn't.

    Quote from: Q-Man on June 21, 2010, 09:44 PM
    No. Good and evil exist independent of the supernatural. They exist as functions of our conscience, reason, rights and obligations.


    No.  If it wasn't for God instructing us as to what was right/wrong, we'd be extinct by now.

    Quote from: Q-Man on June 21, 2010, 09:44 PM
    I know torturing your own children forever, not because they have done wrong to others, but simply because they lacked faith in your authority, is not just wrong, it's downright evil. And if that's what God is doing, then God is evil. But I don't believe in God so I don't have to worry about wrapping my head around such paradoxical concepts of theology.


    God determines what is good and evil, Q-Man.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #590 - June 22, 2010, 12:02 AM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 21, 2010, 11:56 PM
    I have no problems in believing in God Wink

    I have problems finding credible and convincing evidence for God. Specifically the Personal God.

    In the end my philosophy is to do good. Hopefully I leave this world having done good. If a God wants to send me to hell who am I to say no. If He/She/It/Them chooses to send me somewhere else I have no say in the matter.

    In any case I will go up or down like a man. I don't cower or fear because my heart is pure. If there is a God He/She/It/Them should know I loved with my heart and believed with my heart.

    I just can't believe unless there is evidence, I don't trust blind faith anymore because it could mean you believe in practically anything. And I have a rational and logical mindset. It has taken us many places, shined its light in the dark crevices of our history and we have emerged enlightened. Science is based on this mindset, and it is one I respect, it works in the real world. I trust it.

    Btw the reason why I left Islam was because of too many questions, and the answer from Muslim scholars felt like they were trying to answer in a positive light and not in a rational or objective manner. They read it with God-goggles and without those goggles I see the cracks in the edifice. I see the loose threads in the binding. I don't force myself to see it this way, I try to be fair. But it's there.

    I suggest you do the same brother Smiley


    So...

    ...basically you are asking me to trust in my own fallible judgment instead of the infallible judgment of the omniscient creator of all of reality.  And that sounds logical to you?
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #591 - June 22, 2010, 12:09 AM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 22, 2010, 12:02 AM
    So...

    ...basically you are asking me to trust in my own infallible judgment instead of the omniscient creator of all of reality.  And that sounds logical to you?


    Well yeah if your judgment is infallible then why not Tongue

    Jokes aside, the point is that you are assuming this Creator exists. Which is fine. That's one level.

    The other point is, you're assuming this Creator revealed, wrote the Quran. That my friend is less fine. That one is hard to believe, especially when He revealed it via an Angel to a man that was a product of his time, more or less. He was not the best of mankind, or the ultimate man. And the Quran is not the infallible work of an omniscient creator. And the shahada is Allah And Muhammad. You have to accept both.

    You can try to read it that way but I'd be surprised if you didn't have hiccups along the way, or already had.

    We wouldn't need the mountains of tafsirs and scholarly work explaining it if it was that clear (mubeen).
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #592 - June 22, 2010, 12:10 AM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 21, 2010, 10:21 PM
    Your avatar rocks Smiley

    LMAO!
    I created a monster ;P
    Do not look directly at the operational end of the device.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #593 - June 22, 2010, 12:10 AM
    Quote from: hupla on June 21, 2010, 09:57 PM
    You do know that Islamic scholars have looked at this in the past, do you not?
    Conclusions of Al Ghazali:
    There is no free will - only predestination.


    In other words, like those foolish European dudes mentioned in an earlier post, because he couldn't understand the concept of Allah being unaffected by His creation because He friggin' created it and knows ALL the rules, etc. and doesn't HAVE to be subject to anything, Al Ghazali decided that God was actually LYING when he said we have Free Will.  So instead of accepting His guardian Lord as Truth and wrapping his puny thoughts and theories around that truth, he instead, because he couldn't figure it out, decided to alter the Word of God to make himself feel better.

    That's awesome.

    In a dumb@ss kind of way.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #594 - June 22, 2010, 12:16 AM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 22, 2010, 12:09 AM
    The other point is, you're assuming this Creator revealed, wrote the Quran. That my friend is less fine. That one is hard to believe, especially when He revealed it via an Angel to a man that was a product of his time, more or less. He was not the best of mankind, or the ultimate man.


    He was very much the best of mankind and the ultimate man.  What possible criteria are you using to determine that?

    Quote from: BlackDog on June 22, 2010, 12:09 AM
    And the Quran is not the infallible work of an omniscient creator.


    ummm... it totally is.  Totally.  ("Like, Oh my GaawwwDDDD!")

     
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 22, 2010, 12:09 AM
    And the shahada is Allah And Muhammad. You have to accept both.

    You can try to read it that way but I'd be surprised if you didn't have hiccups along the way, or already had.


    What are you talking about, BlackDog?

    Quote from: BlackDog on June 22, 2010, 12:09 AM
    We wouldn't need the mountains of tafsirs and scholarly work explaining it if it was that clear (mubeen).


    God wants it to be about faith.  Why wouldn't He make it "clear" in the way you are asking otherwise.  "Faith" is obviously a big, big deal to Him.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #595 - June 22, 2010, 12:17 AM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 22, 2010, 12:00 AM
    I said:"2.)  Only Allah is the Judge who will know people's final destinations.  I cannot know that man's soul."

    I'm talking about on the level of God being the one who knows more about what an individual did during his lifetime as to whether he really made the cut or not.  I don't watch people that closely.  Only Allah does.  From the outside we can THINK we know whether a person is truly living up to it or not, but God will have the true tally.  Get me?

    No.  If it wasn't for God instructing us as to what was right/wrong, we'd be extinct by now.

    God determines what is good and evil, Q-Man.


    Wrong. God does not exist, and the faster this superstitious nonsense is smashed, the better. Without religion instructing us as to what is right/wrong, and holding us back socially, politically, and scientifically, we'd probably have eliminated world hunger and cured cancer by now. In order to realize our true human potential and live in a more advanced, free and humane society, the institutional and cultural backbone of organized religion must be snapped, like wringing a chicken's neck.
    fuck you
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #596 - June 22, 2010, 12:18 AM
    Quote from: Q-Man on June 22, 2010, 12:17 AM
    Wrong. God does not exist, and the faster this superstitious nonsense is smashed, the better. Without religion instructing us as to what is right/wrong, and holding us back socially, politically, and scientifically, we'd probably have eliminated world hunger and cured cancer by now. In order to realize our true human potential and live in a more advanced, free and humane society, the institutional and cultural backbone of organized religion must be snapped, like wringing a chicken's neck.


    And then have it served at that nice restaurant you mentioned.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #597 - June 22, 2010, 12:20 AM
    hey MRasheed is that Mohammed in your avatar? if so, shouldnt he be wearing a turban?
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #598 - June 22, 2010, 12:20 AM
    Quote from: hupla on June 21, 2010, 10:04 PM
    No - I am merely asking you to follow your own logic to its conclusion.
    I respect that Al Ghazali was able to do this - one may disagree on his premise (that the Qur'an is the word of allah) but at least one must respect the fact that he examines the logical implications of this, tests his beliefs for inconsistencies and ensures that there is a single coherent belief system. Yours is simply a set of shards - and you refuse to look at the edges of those shards.


    TRANSLATION:  "You refuse to abandon what you hold in favor of what we hold!  How frustrating!  You're stupid!!"
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #599 - June 22, 2010, 12:21 AM
    Quote from: Morpheus on June 22, 2010, 12:20 AM
    hey MRasheed is that Mohammed in your avatar? if so, shouldnt he be wearing a turban?


    That's me, dude.
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